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17 Aug 2018 21:32:16
2 Trade Proposals

First.

Colorado Trades
Barrie

Toronto Trades
Brown
Carrick
1st Round Pick 2019


Second.

Detroit Trades
Nyquist

Toronto Trades
Leivo
2nd Round Pick 2019
3rd Round Pick 2020
7th Round Pick 2020


Don't want to hear can't compare The Skinner trade to this because Skinner is injury prone, Skinner has missed only 8 games in 4yrs Nyquist 6 games, if anything Skinner is the better player if compared, Colorado even though they made the playoffs are rebuilding on the fly and my trade Proposal helps them long term as well as this season as both Brown and Carrick will play full time with them.

Thoughts ?

18 Aug 2018 00:28:57
I think you've hit both trades right on the head. There is no way Detroit or Colorado could turn them down. Make sure you email the GM's of all three teams right now and let them take advantage of your superior trade packaging ability.

Colorado and Detroit fans: I'm only kidding, but I just wanted to give Pinball a positive response for once.

18 Aug 2018 01:05:33
1st one no from Colorado and Detroit probably takes that at the deadline but Toronto dose not need Nyquist. He would probably be playing fourth line.

18 Aug 2018 02:54:16
First Trade:

You are trading depth pieces and a 1st for the Avs best Defenseman. Not enough for Barrie. Also the Avs may be rebuilding on the fly like you say but the Avs still need good players to teach and hide the youth behind. Also Avs made the playoffs, they are probably trying to build around MacKinnon and not blow it up.

Second Trade:

I’m pretty sure someone on here literally said that there is no real comparison bar and Skinner trade shouldn’t really used as a comparable. It’s one thing to compare contracts based on similar play, doesn’t necessarily mean th trade values should be the same.

Regardless of th injury history, as a wings fan we decline. Those picks are also expected to be late now with all the expectations as leafs being cup favourites.

I do expect a better offer that doesn’t include fillers like Leivo. Or at least if there is a bidding war then I can see other teams beating that.

Main point- Nyquist won’t be a Maple Leaf. So you can forget it.

18 Aug 2018 03:43:55
Easiest no from Colorado and that’s a lot of nothing for Nyquist but 🤷🏼‍♂️.

16 Aug 2018 14:27:33
Columbus Trades
Panarin

Toronto Trades
Connor Brown
Rasanen (KHL)
1st Round Pick 2019
1st Round Pick 2020*
2nd Round Pick 2020

*Conditional Pick only if Panarin resigns with the Leafs.

As a one Season rental I believe getting a 3rd line 2 way winger in Brown, a good prospect in Rasanen, plus a 1st and 2nd Round Pick in 2019 and 2020 plus a possible extra 1st Round Pick in 2020 is plenty enough to get Panarin, I will probably get backlash again on here but really it's honestly fair and helps both Teams in the big picture.

Thoughts ?

16 Aug 2018 15:05:18
How does it help Columbus? They want to win. why would they give up a guy who scored a point per game for depth and future picks? They will keep Panarin unless they get a solid top-6 forward back, that will contribute to the team now. Which now of these do.

Pinball you get backlash because the trades you propose only make the Leafs better, not the other team. You’re not terrible at determining value, but you need to look at trades from the perspective of both teams.

16 Aug 2018 15:18:14
I guess I don’t see why you always post the same, or very similar proposals all the time. The leafs are not resigning any high end forward not named Matthews, Marner and Nylander. They should keep Brown unless he’s involved in a deal for a defenseman. If Toronto decides to add another scoring threat it will be for this year only. I’m guessing the right deal is not available for a defenseman right now. Please make some new proposals instead of looking for approval from people who are sick of the garbage. Then come back hours later tweaking the same stuff. You’ve been back for a week and it’s getting old already.

16 Aug 2018 15:19:11
ProDepth the problem the Jackets have with Panarin is he will probably walk as a UFA after this Season, if he is locked for even 2yrs than yes it's not enough to get a Top Forward like Panarin, but Columbus needs to move forward for the now and future, I am sure the Islanders are kicking themselves for not getting anything for Tavares and Columbus must have that at the back of there mind, will Columbus win the Cup this coming Season, probably not so keeping Panarin is a step backwards, I made this proposal because Panarin is a rental and in the end is probably going either to a Florida Team or Chicago as a UFA.

16 Aug 2018 15:19:36
Stopppppppp posting crap like this over and over and over and over again.

16 Aug 2018 15:55:29
Keeping Panarin helps them more then this deal does. If they keep Panarin and make a deep run in the playoffs (they had a 3-1 lead on The eventual cup winners; and their team is very young) then maybe Panarin considers resigning or they give the city a playoff run they’ve never experienced.

If they make this trade, the blue jackets become significantly worse (Panarin was a lot of their offence) and none of the pieces coming back will likely be difference makers, and Brown is the only asset that is a safe bet to contribute to the team.

There’s a reason people disagree with your proposals, stop trying to change everyone’s mind.

16 Aug 2018 16:14:42
Again, CLB will be able to get at least this much at the deadline if they decide to trade Panarin. So, they're better off just playing him until then and getting the same assets at the deadline rather than doing the Leafs a favour and sending him to Toronto now.

16 Aug 2018 16:35:13
On top of why would CBJ do it, and other teams would be in the bidding, every trade you make is stacking depth players on depth players.

Championship teams have familiar depth players playing important roles. Lars Eller, Jacob Vrana, even Alex Chiasson on the caps, and Bryan Rust and Carl haglins on the pens. No other team is going to value them as much as their own team. They are not going to fetch you a lot in a trade but they know the system, they know the style of game you want them to play and they can go up and down a lineup while not taking much cap space

Those are Brown, Hyman, Kapanen and Johnsson for us. You aren’t going to get panarin by trading them, but your team has a better chance of going deep or even winning with Matthews, marner, Nylander and those 4 than you do just adding panarin at the expense of your depth.

This one you only have giving up one of them, but I think this offer gets beat.

17 Aug 2018 09:52:02
Maybe try even more quantity instead of quality? lol.

18 Aug 2018 03:09:52
Just cause panarin probably doesn't want to signing clb doesn't mean they want to give him away for spare parts, they start at top 6 winger and go from there, not a bunch of futures, plus those 1st round picks would be late anyway so not sure things by any means.

14 Aug 2018 13:56:12
Detroit Trades
Nyquist

Toronto Trades
Leivo
Joshua (Big-10)
2nd Round Pick 2019
6th Round Pick 2020

Red Wings are in some Cap issues and with more of a rebuild underway and Nyquist to become a UFA after this Season this makes sense for them, plus Leivo will be a regular in the NHL finally which he deserves.
The Leafs add to there Top 6 and Babcock knows Nyquist well from his Detroit Coaching days, it also sets up another Trade to get a Defenceman with either Connor Brown or Kapanen plus there 2019 1st Round Pick being the center pieces.
Ok this post isn't a Panarin Trade Proposal and really does make sense for both Teams.

Thoughts ?

14 Aug 2018 14:16:27
I think you need help.

14 Aug 2018 14:56:38
For this return, I think Detroit is better off just letting him walk at the end of the year.

14 Aug 2018 15:20:29
Similar to the Skinner Trade everyone and Detroit has to get the Cap Space down, to say #memarcusjoe that the Wings would rather Nyquist walk than get that in return tells me you are only looking at this Season for Detroit who won't make the Playoffs with or without Nyquist and Detroit doesn't care about the future or the Salary Cap rules.
I do believe on here people see it's a Pinball Post so of course it's slammed.

14 Aug 2018 15:46:11
Actually Pinball, it's just that if you want a team to trade with you, you need to give them an incentive. You've offered two players with a low percentage chance of becoming 4th liners in the NHL. Along with 2 picks that have an even lower chance of making it to the NHL at all. So, why would they trade him? They can likely get at least that return and probably more at the deadline from a contending team and they've been able to use him for half a season.

14 Aug 2018 17:55:58
mwmarcusjoe Nyquist was a 4th Round Pick so to say a 2nd Round Pick isn't worth anything makes no sense, the only reason Leivo isn't a regular is because the Leafs forwards are to deep and he has scored in every league he has ever Played in he just needs to play, Nyquist is a UFA and not as good as Skinner is and Carolina got less, so I see a trade even though you see Nyquist as more than what he is.

14 Aug 2018 18:05:06
yeah no thanks,

You want nyquist start think rental price 1st and b prospect. Possible retention for a better prospect. Easy 20 goals and 30 assists. COuld produce more with a better team.

14 Aug 2018 18:12:32
Pinball, exactly as Redwing1 says. The Wings will get more trading him at the deadline. They have no obligation to do the Leafs a favour and take a lowball offer just because you want them to. No matter how much you try to rationalize it.

14 Aug 2018 18:19:07
Ok #redwing1

Nyquist for Leivo, Joshua, 1st Round Pick 2019.

Is that enough?

I would do that if I where Dubas also.

14 Aug 2018 19:11:57
Few things to consider:

1. Skinner may be the more productive player over Nyquist but also is way more injury prone which lowered his value. Nyquist is healthier and could use a change of scenery.

2. Detroit has been under Babcock's coaching for so long that many players are tired of him. I think even Nyquist can attest to this, so him wanting to go to Toronto based on familiarity may only be one sided. You would have better luck with Glenndenning instead.

3.With Zetterberg's likely injury, he will go on LTIR. So we don't need cap space immediately. We can get it easily by deadline trading these players. There is not a big rush.

4. If we trade Nyquist as a rental, we will still have enough room to maximize his value. We obviously won't get what Tatar got but we could still get a 2nd, 3rd and ok prospect. Maybe even more with retention.

5. @Pinball, your last deal still only gives us a first of value and two useless players. I think we could get better elsewhere if that's TOs best offer.

14 Aug 2018 19:18:33
Again the Wings are over the Cap by almost 4 million, they have to shed salary before preseason not at the deadline mwmarcusjoe.
Salary Cap rules are in place and Detroit is over the Cap.

14 Aug 2018 20:00:58
Skinner is injury prone #Datsyuk_Fan13?
Skinner in 4yrs has missed 8 games Nyquist 6 games only 2 more games than Nyquist, so before you post know your facts, Skinner is a better player than Nyquist again that's a fact, also what Carolina got for Skinner is still less than my proposal, Carolina set the bar for 50 point wingers going into there last year before being a UFA and weather it's the Leafs or another Team what I proposed is about right. Again that's fact.

14 Aug 2018 20:43:02
@Pinball

I was referring to Skinner having had multiple concussions in his history. He is finally starting to show signs of recovery.

Concussion issues even in the past still hurt trade value.

If h gets another one, then those many games played the last 4 years you mentioned are pointless.

I agree Skinner is the better player but doesn’t mean everyone else will sell for that low.

Also the Canes took this deal because they didn’t want to risk lowering his value, an injury or poor production would have hurt it.

14 Aug 2018 20:46:05
I’ll just say this. There is absolutely no way Nyquist should get what Skinner got. I think a 2nd for Nyquist is more then fair but even just giving a 7th is redundant from a Toronto POV where would he even play?

A team like Columbus will probably acquire him for a 2nd or a 3rd + a prospect. Teams are starting to become reluctant to trade 1sts and no one will give an Unconditional 1st.

I feel like just the username it’s self is leading to hate.

14 Aug 2018 20:50:22
Also in regards to cap space, I am pretty sure LTiR will end up covering most of this.

If not then we will make a trade and get the return we like, so far I’m not loving the Leafs proposal you mentioned so don’t count on the leafs getting Nyquist.

P. s I looked up and found a fact that the last trade between Wings and Leafs was March 24, 1998


Not expecting another one anytime soon.

14 Aug 2018 21:23:45
I just don't think the Skinner trade set a bar (TBH I don't think there is ever a bar ) . Mostly because when there is a good player to get and there is no NTC then a biding war happens ya it might not get super high. IK we all think our GM is stupid at times but they also look to what they think is best for the team. For all we know Skinner could have been sold low due to them just wanting to trade him and his NMC affected some of those trades.

14 Aug 2018 23:14:31
That's true ctc and also the prospect they got back could have been higher on there radar then most people think he is.

15 Aug 2018 05:36:06
Nyquist isn’t really anything special tho no team will start a bidding war.

15 Aug 2018 17:27:01
Why is there an argument about nyquist on here.
after the leafs detroit is my second favourite team, nyquist really isn't that great highest points in season was 54, 4 years ago. he has had 40, 48, 43, 54, 48 over his past 5 years in the league. He is not worth a 1st as a bunch of guys on here are saying (could he get a return with one, honestly I wouldn't be surprised. i won't overestimate nhl gms)

on the the return, a 2nd + 3rd/ 4th probably gets him. With Lievo he easily makes the red wings top 9 (without nyquist) would you take any of glendenning/ bertuzzi/ frk over him? i sure as hell wouldnt. he doesn't fit on the leafs forwards core because they have at least 12 fwrds better than him.

I'd love for Det to get a 1st for nyquist but i'm not sur eit will happen. also why does nyquist fit on the leafs? the only forwards I take nyquist over are brown, ennis, lindholm who will most likely be tor's 4th line. (for what its worth nyquist is probably better than kapanen/ johnsson right now but i take that youth and upside over him our top 9)

Wow I just wasted my time on Gustav Nyquist. i swear he better get the wings a 1st now.

15 Aug 2018 20:44:28
Skinner had his injuries earlier but they weren’t missing tons of time. And over his last 5 seasons, he has 140g while missing a total of 18 games. An argument of Nyquists durability over skinner does not hold water lol.

15 Aug 2018 21:59:22
Big Z, well said. You’re dead on. Only guys he could beat out are guys we expect to put up his type of pts (45-55) down the road and they’re dirt cheap right now and need the experience. Extremely counter productive.

15 Aug 2018 22:34:39
We don't need more offence.

15 Aug 2018 23:07:29
Big Z is right 100%.

16 Aug 2018 21:14:37
That is what everyone is saying. But for some reason every leaf trade proposed has been for a fwd and they don't need that and we all see it and disagree because of that fact not value wise.

14 Aug 2018 00:12:45
Columbus Trades
Panarin
3rd Round Pick 2019

Toronto Trades
Gardiner
Connor Brown
1st Round Pick 2019

Thoughts ?

14 Aug 2018 02:38:38
Columbus doesn't want or need Gardiner. It weakens the trade by including Gardiner.

They will want a Kapanen or Johnsson type prospect +.

14 Aug 2018 02:46:28
Let it go Pinball. Try and get Muzzin ect.

14 Aug 2018 05:20:17
I kinda disagree Columbus needs another puck mover on defence. I also think Gardiner gets a bad rap. He has warts in his game but he can advance the puck.

14 Aug 2018 12:57:17
I have gotten it's not enough for Panarin etc, so I added Gardiner and took out Rasanen and Joshua and still mostly get not good enough.
If Columbus is in a win now attitude how is this proposal not in this Trade, Gardiner got 52 points in 82 games last year which is a Top pairing defence with Seth Jones, Werenski and Ryan Murray drop down to give the Jackets a Top Defense in the NHL, Connor Brown isn't Panarin but is still a very good 2 way winger that fits in with what the Jackets have now, and swapping a 1st Rounder for a 3rd Rounder should be enough, yes the Leafs will have to go out and get a Faulk or Spurgeon but that's easier right now than getting a difference maker in Panarin.

14 Aug 2018 13:48:02
Pinball It's not always about value but needs Toronto doesn't need Panarin as of rn that is the big issue (at least IMO )
don't get me wrong he is a great player but Toronto has him in spades practically what toronto needs is rather vets that can help out in depth FWD roles or top-4 D.

15 Aug 2018 17:35:47
The only defenceman better than gardiner right now is Jones (one of the best in the league), werenski is going to better than gardiner i'm sure but you can't say that columbus can't use a 50 pt puck moving dman. having werenski+jones on the first line with gardiner+murray/ savard on the 2nd pair is an amazing top 4.
Connor brown makes almost ever top 9 in the league and is a really good two way player. and then there's the most likely late 1st. The team doesn't get much worse and gains a 1st

Thats a decent return for a pending ufa. ugh I don't like defending pinball.

16 Aug 2018 00:35:46
If Gardiner is a 50 point D man then Werenski is a 47 point D. Columbus doesn’t need Gardiner, yeah he’d be nice to have but I don’t think Columbus is desperate enough yet to have him as the main piece for Panarin. Werenski and Murray as there top 4 left D is solid they don’t need Gardiner or Murray playing 3rd pair.

13 Aug 2018 14:05:19
Columbus Trades
Panarin

Toronto Trades
Connor Brown
Rasanen (KHL)
Joshua (Big-10)
1st Round Pick 2019
1st Round Pick 2020*

*Columbus only gets that Pick if Panarin resigns with the Leafs.

Without Panarin the Jackets are actually still pretty good upfront, with these projected lines.

Jenner-Dubois-Atkinson
Foligno-Wennberg-Bjorkstrand
Milano-Nash-Brown
Duclair-Dubinsky-Anderson

If Columbus waits it out until the Deadline they won't get as much in a Trade.
Leafs are that close to truly being a Team that's almost unbeatable adding Panarin puts them there.

Thoughts ?

13 Aug 2018 15:07:19
Columbus is going to want more quality back. I feel like every trade you’ve ever posted is just quantity for quality. You have to give up something big to get something big, which Panarin is.

13 Aug 2018 16:06:38
even is clb accepts, which they wouldnt. the leafs can't afford to resign pana. god your clueless.

13 Aug 2018 16:46:01
If Columbus plays that game of wanting more they will get nothing, Skinner didn't even get Carolina a 1st Round Pick, Islanders played that game with Tavares and look what happened.
Connor Brown is an NHL Player a decent 2 way winger that's only 24yrs old, Rasanen and Joshua are Prospects that just might be NHL Players and any Team wants 1st Round Picks.
Panarin is only for this year and why not try and win this year, with Grundstrom and Engvall probably ready next year there are more coming including Bracco etc.
Columbus will Trade Panarin because of what happened with Tavares, if they try and wait out to get more than next July they will watch him walk and get nothing just like what happened with the Islanders, most on here truly believe Columbus has the upper hand they don't as every Team knows the reality that Columbus is not in a good position with Panarin.

13 Aug 2018 17:09:30
Not sure what's worse, your proposal or your justification. Columbus, if they trade Panarin are going to want players for present. Not futures. The are a vary competitive club that has serious playoff hopes.

13 Aug 2018 17:20:14
For this offer, Columbus would be better off just keeping Panarin and letting him walk for nothing at the end of the year if they don't want to trade him at the deadline.

Panarin will provide more value to the Jackets this year than your offer likely ever will.

13 Aug 2018 17:56:36
Quit worrying about Panarin, and try to figure out how to strengthen your D. if you need forwards, which ya dont. think gritty. Ya have enough finesse.

13 Aug 2018 18:49:37
As for the Defense on the Leafs I believe no trade has happened because they expect Liljegren to be on the Leafs this Season.
Babcock loves bringing in Young Players to teach them early
projected Defence Pairings.

Rielly-Hainsey
Gardiner-Zaitsev
Dermott-Liljegren/ Carrick

Liljegren and Carrick will share playing time next Season so the Season after when Hainsey isn't resigned the Right Side looks pretty strong with
Liljegren
Zaitsev
Carrick

Gardiner probably replaced by Borgman/ Rosen on the Left Side when Gardiner walks probably to Minnesota his hometown after this Season.
So yes I still believe that a Panarin type player would be a smart move for this year.
My Proposed Lineup if that Trade where to happen.

Johnsson-Tavares-Nylander
Panarin-Matthews-Hyman
Marleau-Kadri-Marner
Ennis-PLindholm-Kapanen

Does everyone now see how Panarin does fit in over Connor Brown?
As for not being Gritty enough the only player on the Caps you would call grit was Wilson and on Tampa Bay the best record last year in the NHL Stamkos had the most penalty mins.

13 Aug 2018 18:50:31
Pinball there’s not a chance on earth you could convince anyone that this is a good trade for Columbus lol.

13 Aug 2018 21:43:43
“Almost unbeatable”, that’s priceless. The “right side looks pretty strong with Liljegren, Zaitsev, Carrick. ” Please go back into hiding. You bring the rest of us down with your Rambo like garbage.

13 Aug 2018 21:50:49
Pinball. I'm not even saying ya need Grit. I don't beleive ya need any forwards, I beleive you have the 2nd best group next to Winnipeg. but, maybe a Gritty Veteran I anything, a depth guy maybe with some leadership. that's all. but ya don't need Panarin. sure ya want him. all teams would .
So. try and figure how Leafs could get a strong decent top 4 Dman. that's what this team needs.

13 Aug 2018 22:00:48
Wow that’s a ugly defense! Better home that offense scores 5 a game.

13 Aug 2018 22:01:44
I feel like Columbus will just use him for a playoff run then he’ll sign in like Florida or New Jersey ( a big market team with cap space ) .

13 Aug 2018 23:38:16
If you are a playoff team which Columbus is you aren’t loosing him for nothing you’re just not trading him for other assets. He is as valuable to the team in the playoffs or even more if they feel like they have a serious shot then whatever they get back in a trade.

14 Aug 2018 04:06:48
Ouf I don’t know if pinball is Hoffman for 5th overall or Ceci for 11th and 12th overall bad.

15 Aug 2018 12:15:35
I was somewhat on board with your explanation until you said ‘unbeatable’ lol it’s a 31 team league. No one is unbeatable. Playoffs, anything can happen and even regular season, 50+ wins is considered a good season and that still means you lost 32 times.

15 Aug 2018 12:34:14
I watched liljegren a lot last year. He looked great at times and very raw at others which is expected for a 19 year old playing pro hockey in North America for the first time. I would be very shocked if he’s on the leafs this year. Babcock liked having young guys in big roles 2 years ago when the expectations were extremely low. They’re expected to win now. He’s not going to have liljegren costing them games, and if he does make the team, his partner is not going to be dermott with his like 30 NHL games.

12 Aug 2018 01:20:16
Arizona Trades
Demers
1st Round Pick 2019

Toronto Trades
Nylander

Thoughts ?

12 Aug 2018 04:29:30
Ridiculous. Jason Demers? The guy that was traded for Jamie McGinn? The cap dump? The 1st is nice but why does Toronto need a 1st.

12 Aug 2018 07:19:21
Pinny, ya went from one extreme to the other.

Are you trying to prove a point that you aren’t ‘Leaf Biased’? Still not working.

12 Aug 2018 08:08:01
Just because FLA terribly undersold Demers, does not mean he's worth nothing. Not saying it's a good trade for TOR, but Demers is def a piece of worth that would instantly improve TORs top 4.

12 Aug 2018 10:42:58
@TT

At full price, for three more years, i'd be wary. Need the cap space for tne big three.

Trade in general is awful for TO tho, lol.

12 Aug 2018 14:37:26
Yah and Milan Lucic would would improve Toronto ECHLs affiliates bottom 9 but that dosent mean the leafs are interested in that contract.

12 Aug 2018 15:28:56
Vbb, why you always bring up random things nobody else has said anything about? And just saying demers was -4, not great but when oel is -28 and goligoski is -31, doesn't look so bad.

12 Aug 2018 16:07:42
If Arizona is the worst Team and win the Draft Lottery Jack Hughes on the Leafs looks pretty darn good.

12 Aug 2018 21:47:19
ARZ going to be close to the playoffs next year, imo
@TSS: I'd be fine with paying Demers 4.5 the next three years in general. I understand the incoming cap crunch for the Leafs, but you won't win anything with a good offense but meh D. Some of the dollars need to be invested in D and if you can't have all 4 good F anyways, might as well trade one for D help.

12 Aug 2018 22:54:52
Ok the Leafs add a 2nd Round Pick and Arizona adds Strome.
Revised Trade Proposal.

Arizona Trades
Strome
Demers
1st Round Pick 2019

Toronto Trades
Nylander
2nd Round Pick 2019

Thoughts?

12 Aug 2018 22:56:37
Demers might not be as bad as people say, but he’s not the type of Dman you trade Nylander for lol I don’t care if a first is coming back too unless this is a deadline deal and Arizona is bottom 3 in the league.

Nylander will be signed, and if he is traded it will be for a legit top pair Dman (not necessarily 1-for-1, but in a package) . You don’t trade young elite offensive talent to plug a hole down your line up lol not saying Nylander is Taylor Hall whatsoever, but look how that’s turned out.

11 Aug 2018 16:24:57
Carolina Trades
Faulk

Toronto Trades
Leivo
Holl (AHL)
7th Round Pick 2019
2nd Round Pick 2020

Leafs as everyone knows looking for that RHanded Pairing Defenceman for Rielly.
Leivo is the Canes 4th Line RWinger with McGinn and Martinook and finally gets to play regularly, Holl is the 7th Defenceman and deserves to be in the NHL at this stage.
Canes add to there future Drafts with 2 extra 2nd Round Picks for 2019 and 2020.
Good Trade for both Teams.

Thoughts ?

11 Aug 2018 17:14:32
If RHD Holl is so close at 26 years old, why hasn't he cracked the Leafs weak right side defense? Levio at best is a 4th line player and with the picks this package just doesn't add up to getting Faulk.

11 Aug 2018 18:42:35
Pinball you’re going to give me an aneurism soon.

11 Aug 2018 19:29:40
You don’t even try do you pinball? Does that sound fair to you. A bunch of maybe’s for a top 4 RH d man.

11 Aug 2018 20:00:13
I’d do Horton or the Rights to Kessels retained salary for Faulk but that’s about it. He does not fit with the leafs at all.

11 Aug 2018 20:42:33
Idk Skinner was a Top 2 LWinger for Carolina and they got squat for him.
On Carolina's Right Side you have.
Hamilton
Pesce
TVR
Faulk is expendable at this point.
Left Side
deHaan
Slavin
HFluery
Believe me everyone with the Canes GM players like Skinner and Faulk can be traded for without top assets.

12 Aug 2018 07:20:51
Legit a 2nd and complete spare parts for a top4 RHD.

Leivo, Holl and the 7th combined prolly get a 4th and 6th, lol.

12 Aug 2018 15:06:53
Welp, I just got dumber bu reading this nonsense. thanks pinball, you have to be a troll or just really low iq.

12 Aug 2018 15:33:58
Scraps for a good defenseman? That's really bad, thought it must be a joke until you defended it, check out the agrees, ya, everyone else is crazy, it's not you.

12 Aug 2018 22:58:35
Carolina laughs value wise, not even close.

On the other side, I’ve said 100 times, I just don’t see why people want Faulk on riellys right side. Rielly has become a much more rounded player but is still far from a defensive force. Faulk is all offense. I truly believe if Faulk was on Toronto’s radar, they would have had him before the draft. We have seen how low the canes were willing to sell on Skinner and leafs would have traded there 25th pick in June for Faulk if the fitness there. I think leafs management also sees that he isn’t the guy to make the team better. He would be great for a team that needs to move the puck up or needs a QB for the PP. With Rielly, Gardiner and Dermott, we’re covered.

11 Aug 2018 06:51:34
Toronto trades: Brown, Gardiner

Winnipeg trades: Myers, Perrault

Smt along these lines what do you think?

11 Aug 2018 07:20:17
The Jets have absolutely no need for Brown and would probably rather keep Myers than trade for Gardiner. So, Winnipeg would decline.

11 Aug 2018 09:24:54
There is no way the Jets would make this trade as Perreault is a much better player than Brown, who would be behind Wheeler, Laine, and Tanev. The Jets would rather bring up younger, homegrown players like Appleton, Vesalainen and Lemieux. Gardner is a 28 year old defensive liability that makes the same mistakes an 18 year rookie makes and will be a UFR next season so why would the Jets want him? Let him stay with the Leafs and be their headache.

11 Aug 2018 15:22:31
Jake Gardiner out scored all of Winnepegs deffensman including the legend Wayne ( Trouba ) Gretzky. That’s all I’m going to say and was + 9 which was equal to Myers.

11 Aug 2018 16:25:31
He clearly said Gardiner is a defensive liability not on offensive one. IDK why you would bring points but alright

11 Aug 2018 17:13:29
Just pointing out Gardiner is much better then Myers.

11 Aug 2018 18:16:38
Still laughing at Perrault being much better than brown. Brown is younger and a better Pker and on a better contract. But whatever.

11 Aug 2018 18:43:24
Gardiner isn’t better than Myers.

11 Aug 2018 19:48:32
Here we go again with jets/ leafs comparisons. Islandjet a career 40 point guy is not a much better player than Brown. He’s 6 years younger with a couple good seasons behind him already and he’s good on the pk. Brown has also been 3/ 4 line only. I’m pretty sure Perrault even gets PP time but I could be wrong. I’m not saying Brown is a superstar but Perrault is not all that either. Myers is better than Gardiner defensively for sure but there’s not a person on this site that gives him credit for his offensive awareness. I’d like to see Gardiner play with a real solid d man that could cover for him once in a while. Had Myers not just come off one of his best seasons yet I’d say it’s a close deal but I think it would take more from Toronto.

11 Aug 2018 20:06:15
Well Defensively you can’t argue Gardiner is way better then Myers and offensively I’d say Gardiner is better so can you please find statistics to prove Myers is better then Gardiner in anyway not even just hockey like anything Gardiner is litterly better then him at every aspect of life.

11 Aug 2018 21:21:35
Vbbbvvbb. did you say Gardiner is better than Myers defensively? Myers has the defensive aspect over Gardiner, Gardiner is better offensively. Overall value is not far apart.

12 Aug 2018 01:26:46
Myers really isn’t known to be a strong defensive player off the rush he gets beat much more then Gardiner. His stalky 6.8 frame takes up space in his own zone tho.

12 Aug 2018 15:54:08
@vbbbvvbb then you haven't watched Myers' goal against the wild in game 2 of the playoffs. Legit just danced around the defender to score. Haven't seen Gardiner do that, let alone in the playoffs

12 Aug 2018 16:08:56
If the Jets did make this trade in the long run it would not address the long term problem it would cause. Of the next 4 Jets A defense prospects, Niku, Stanley and Samberg they all shoot left with only Poolman being a RHD. Getting Gardner may fit in now but the next 2 years they would be looking for another RHD. This trade makes no sense for the Jets.

12 Aug 2018 16:50:42
I actually seen that goal it was dirty.

10 Aug 2018 21:15:55
Toronto: Josh Leivo

NYI: Micheal Del Colle

Toronto- gives Leivo a new chance considering there is no use for him in their organization. Del Colle could Battle Timoshov/Bracco for a top 6 spot on the Marlies. He has lots of talent but his draft position was to high.

Islanders- get a proven depth forward who can slot in on the third line or be a top line player in the AHL. He's really a player you can plug into any situation. Could be a full time NHLer with the right opportunity.

10 Aug 2018 21:21:58
I think if Lou believed in him enough to trade a former top 5 pick for him, he would have forced Babcock a little harder to get him in some games. This one I would do from leafs perspective for sure because dal Colle is still young enough. But ideally, we get a pick, free up a roster spot and use both at the deadline if there’s a need to address.

10 Aug 2018 21:43:32
I don’t think the top 5 pick tital holds much value if he’s not considered a bust I’m not sure what is. I doubt he could bring back more then what Edmonton got for Yakapov. I just want to see leivo get a chance in a new organization I don’t care what they get.

11 Aug 2018 01:22:46
Del colle has really looked bad hey. I wonder what the problem is with him.

11 Aug 2018 02:10:44
I know the top 5 doesn’t hold much anymore. Just don’t see them giving him up for Leivo. New management so they aren’t connected to that pick like Snow was, but he still just turned 22 and some of those power forwards take a bit of time. Don’t see them moving him for a guy that Lou just had for the last 3 years and he never made that team.

I want to see Leivo get a chance somewhere too tho.

11 Aug 2018 04:53:19
I think this year could still be a make or break year for him though. He was never the fastest skater but wasn't by no means slow. his stick handeling and overall puck skills were great when he was in junior I thought for sure he'd be a full time nhl forward by now.

11 Aug 2018 05:29:41
It looks like Del Colle is a career AHL/ Euro player but if he has the passion you never know.

11 Aug 2018 05:38:08
Dal Colles main problem is skating. Watching him play it seems he's carrying cement in his skates.

10 Aug 2018 16:31:17
Toronto Trades
Leivo

Winnipeg Trades
Dano

Bottom 9 depth trade Jets need a RWinger and Leafs need a Centre to spell Lindholm.

Thoughts ?

10 Aug 2018 17:13:15
Dano is a right winger.

10 Aug 2018 17:13:58
This trade doesn't help or hurt either team. Leivo is bigger which the Jets like but Dano is younger. I don't believe that Leivo could make the Jets as they have younger more skilled home grown players that will be given a chance at the 4th line. I hope both players get traded to teams that will give them a fair chance to play as they both have NHL talent but are with teams that are deep at their positions.

10 Aug 2018 18:35:34
No reason for either team to make this trade. The Jets don't need Leivo and the Leafs don't need Dano.

10 Aug 2018 18:45:27
Dano is listed as a centre, But you know better than me where he actually plays. Regardless, leafs signed Par lindholm amd Josh Jooris as options for 4th line centre on July 1st, plus just re-signed Freddy Gauthier for 2 years who I still think the management has a soft spot for and wants him to succeed but this is probably his last crack at the leafs roster before he’s just the marlies career captain.

10 Aug 2018 19:24:33
I agree with you Unbiased Jim about Gauthier and the Leafs. This is another player that needs a trade to another team to get a fair chance to play at the NHL level, much like Petan and Dano with the Jets.

10 Aug 2018 20:44:35
Gauthier dosent need to be traded the leafs have a open 4c spot and if he’s good enough he’ll take it. He’s just flat out not good enough for a full time position.

10 Aug 2018 20:46:33
Jets RWing Depth.
Laine
Wheeler
Little

Dano is more a Centre than a RWinger.
Jets are deep at Centre even with Stastny in Vegas.
It's a move for both players to possibly play more.
I know Leivo will play more in the Peg than with the Leafs and he deserves to play regularly.

10 Aug 2018 20:52:26
Unless I'm mistaken he has never played centre in Winnipeg I'm not sure if he has at the NHL level at all.

10 Aug 2018 21:29:15
Yeah, I don’t know if Gauthier needs to be traded, he’s got a spot in front of him here, just hasn’t grabbed it. The one time he really looked like he was stringing together some good games and gaining trust, he got hurt and it took him months to get another shot.

He’s a big centre (6’5 or 6’6) which there’s always a spot for, but you need to still be able to move in the league now. He’s worked on it a lot and is a far better skater than before, but still never going to be fast. Don’t know if other teams would have any more use for him than we do unfortunately.

I Watched him all through the marlies playoffs and was first row behind the bench for game 7 of the finals when they won. You hear him on the bench, winning or losing he was always talking guys up. And when they won he kinda led the celebration. guys a riot. That’s why I said AHL captain if he can’t make the NHL. Seems like a great team guy and the other players love him.

10 Aug 2018 21:56:10
Did you actually say that little is a winger. The player who until the last couple years was the first line center for them that little.

10 Aug 2018 22:44:17
Unbiased Jim From what you wrote Gauthier is the kind of player fans root for and hope that they can make the big team. Unfortunately time eventually runs out if a player can't crack the line-up by time they are 23 or 24.

10 Aug 2018 23:40:55
Little has played RWing for a few years now yes.

11 Aug 2018 02:17:52
@IJ, for sure. I hope he makes the team every year but it’s hard for him. It’s like he’s born 10 years too late lol I go to a lot of marlies games tho and if he’s a top guy there, I don’t think it’s a bad thing. He could possibly make a bigger impact for the organization Being a role model and helping our prospect pool down there then as a 4th liner.

09 Aug 2018 14:49:12
Columbus Trades
Panarin
Ryan Murray

Toronto Trades
Gardiner
Connor Brown
Rasanen (KHL)
1st Round Pick 2019

Thoughts ?

09 Aug 2018 16:01:43
Gonna need more from Leafs.

09 Aug 2018 16:03:51
And. Leafs don't need Panarin
. Leafs have great forwards. but weak. D and a mediocre Goalie. so go get that. not more forwards.

09 Aug 2018 16:26:07
I wish you never came back if that’s the first thing I’m going to see you post. Lol.

09 Aug 2018 16:38:32
No from CBJ. Gardiner and murray May wash out. I think Gardiner is better, murray is younger and I believe has more term.

But a lot of teams would offer far more than brown, a late 1st and a B prospect for panarin. None of those pieces will give Columbus a future game breaker. When trading a star, you need to be a confident that there’s at least a chance one of the pieces coming back will be a star too.

Don’t think Brown, Rasanen or a late 1st gives them that confidence. Liljegren or Sandin would have to be included, then add.

09 Aug 2018 17:09:06
Andersen is a Top 10 Goaltender not a mediocre one.
If the Jackets want Liljegren then you have to change Murray to Werenski.
Has everyone been asleep and not see what the market will be since the Skinner trade.
Yes Panarin is better but still no 1st Round Pick for Skinner and one prospect that might or might not ever make it in the NHL.
My proposal I have a proven NHLer in Brown a 1st Round Pick a prospect just like the Skinner deal plus like Panarin a Top 2 Defenceman on his last year before becoming a UFA.
In 3yrs most on here looked at every Leaf Player as garbage and in 3yrs look at the Team now.
Sorry everyone Gardiner and Brown are good NHL Players and giving a 1st Round Pick plus Rasanen is there value wise for Panarin and Murray.

09 Aug 2018 17:23:25
Panarin is on another level than skinner.

09 Aug 2018 17:24:10
And then you bring up Columbus also needs to add Werenski Hahahaha.

09 Aug 2018 17:30:11
Leafs don't need Panarin and wouldn't get him for this package. Would have to be a rental for the year because they couldn't afford him and their core.
I thought the trade was funny, but then you topped it when you said if Lilegren was included they had to upgrade to Wrenski.
Agreed, the Skinner trade did silence the market. We won't see another trade involving a sizable player for a while until that dies down is my guess.

09 Aug 2018 17:37:58
Panarin has the 4th most points 5v5 last 2 years in nhl, fair to say comparing him and skinner is pretty off. Would look great playing with Torontos players but definitely not what they need and no way they could resign him anyway. Really not a well thought suggestion and living in video game land or something.

09 Aug 2018 04:41:30
Canucks trade: tanev, grandlund, 2nd round pick 2019

Leafs trade: liljegren, 3rd round pick 2019


??

10 Aug 2018 20:06:24
you can keep Tanev. He is not worth it.

You keep what you got. We will keep what we got.
Trade Over!

08 Aug 2018 02:22:00
What do you guys think of Kapanen+ Carrick

4

Justin Braun +2nd

Brauns controllable for Another Year. Which is BIG for toronto and its at a really reasonable sub 4mil. I would believe this would be an upgrade over Carrick Would maybe even potentially make Gardiner Expendable. I think Reilly Braun would be a sick top 2.

I think its a lot for toronto to give up but their need for a RHD they can control they're going to need to pony up. With their depth they can afford to make this. move. it does make toronto a little older however they're deep enough . Edmonton is a perfect example you need experienced durable. guys with the youngins to win.

08 Aug 2018 05:38:00
Perhaps you overvalue Braun; he's good, but that's quite the package, and the 2nd doesn't really help for the leafs when they want to win now.

08 Aug 2018 09:17:11
33 points last year, could stick around that or better playing better minutes. Don’t know much about Braun but I’m assuming he has more value than Carrick. And Kapanen might have slightly more value than a San Jose 2nd maybe. Personally don’t see much of a reason for the sharks to do it. Also don’t know if the leafs would want to trade Kapanen for a short term average D.

08 Aug 2018 10:28:27
I’m sorry but did you say Edmonton is a perfect example of what it takes to win?

08 Aug 2018 14:17:16
How does this help San Jose? They give up a top 4 D for some guys that would be in depth roles. Sharks want to win.

08 Aug 2018 18:38:04
@Leafs17. I think he meant that when they had all those young top picks but not the veterans around them they couldn’t win. I could be wrong but I think he was saying they were an example of not winning, meaning to win you need the other way lol.

08 Aug 2018 18:52:09
Braun is pretty meh. but I guess so are the Leafs RHD. I think Toronto would be better off trading a bigger package for a better D man.

08 Aug 2018 21:03:40
This to me is like when people were saying to trade brown+ A pick for Demers. It’s a stop gap Dman that isn’t a huge upgrade. I’d rather them commit to a trade for a good RHD in the core age (Colin Miller, Ryan Pulock, Jacob Trouba) or go with what they have. But giving up depth for another D that isn’t a for sure upgrade on our top 4 doesn’t make a lot of sense.

08 Aug 2018 22:48:49
Thanks for the clarification Jim. I agree with prodepth, the sharks have been in win now mode for a few years now. I don’t see them trading Braun away at the moment.

09 Aug 2018 17:10:40
No problem. With Tavares, Marleau, hainsey, Gardiner, Kadri even mchilliney, they do have plenty of good veterans to help the youth though. Those guys all have like 500 games (or just under), a cpl of them 1000 games. And they aren’t just 4th line guys. They’re playing big roles right along side the top young players. So I don’t see ‘veteran help for young guys’ as a reason to get a guy like Braun. Even Rielly is considered a young D but he has almost 400 NHL games already and Zaitsev was a 7 year pro overseas before coming over.

But for sure I don’t see why sharks do it either.

07 Aug 2018 20:18:00
So I posted a Leafs-Canes trade for Pesce a few days ago but I thought up a more revised version of the potential deal.

To TOR:
Brett Pesce

To CAR:
Jake Gardiner
Kasperi Kapanen
Garrett Sparks
2019 1st Round Pick

TOR gets a big, young, right-handed, defense-oriented D-man who's on a reasonable deal for many years.

CAR really shores up their offense (an area of weakness for them) with Gardiner (50+ point D-man), they add a young, high-skill forward in Kapanen, they get a top goaltending prospect in Sparks (another area in which they aren't necessarily strong) and a 1st round pick to boot.

Thoughts?

07 Aug 2018 20:54:42
Lol @ Sparks= “ top goaltending prospect “.

07 Aug 2018 22:12:23
Its Gardiner's first season with over 50 pts in his 7 year nhl career. You can't just throw-in (50 point d-man) if he just reached that once.

08 Aug 2018 00:16:27
@vb You're right, he's not a "top prospect" but on a team like Carolina, he'd easily become the backup to Darling and potentially even become the starter over time if given the starts.

@Crazy You're also correct however, the point I was trying to make with that was that Gardiner is great offensively, he ranks 30th among defensemen in terms of points over the past 5 seasons, a lot of which were with the Leafs at the dead bottom (or close to it) of the standings. He's only had less than 30 points in 1 FULL season of his career and so, the 52 points he had the last season really is the cherry on top in terms to his offensive game and on a team that doesn't have very many major offensive threats like Carolina, that goes a long way.

08 Aug 2018 02:26:39
Pesce best season is 20 points and was only a plus in 3 seasons once he's not worth a first let alone adding all the players. Its more than leaf fans who are delerious on here.

08 Aug 2018 06:20:07
I guess you obviously never heard of Alex Nedejkovic

@Just a leafs fan

He’s their future in net.

09 Aug 2018 17:46:03
Its easy to hit disagree on my comment but at least back it up.

09 Aug 2018 19:55:51
@ carnyslop

I agree he's not worth all those players but I would say he's worth more then just a mid-late 1st as he is used against other teams top lines and shuts them down well and is also young with a good contract I see something around TOR first and Kapanen would be a good deal for both teams.

07 Aug 2018 13:21:44
Toronto Trades
Connor Brown
Carrick
Sparks
1st Round Pick 2019

Winnipeg Trades
Trouba

Thoughts ?

07 Aug 2018 14:57:12
There is nothing in that offer that the Jets need at all. They wouldn't consider that deal in the slightest.

07 Aug 2018 15:04:51
The Jets don't need quantity as they have players that are better than the ones being offered in this trade. All three players offered would be UFA in 2 years, would not be an upgrade in what the Jets have on their 3rd or 4th lines. Comrie is younger and has more upside in goal than Sparks. The 1st would be nice but would be in the mid 20's and a player drafted then is no guarantee that they will be a top end player. The Jets would need a top line player, or a can't miss A prospects plus draft choices back for Trouba who would be the Leafs top pairing RHD.

07 Aug 2018 15:49:16
Carrick is a fringe RHD. Brown is the best piece there as he could be a good depth guy with some secondary offense and sparks has no chance to take hellbyucks job and they have plenty of G depth behind him with brossoit, comrie, is hutch still there?!

Jets want atleast one REALLy good young piece coming back. It’s just not there.

07 Aug 2018 15:55:35
Why all leafs trades involve the same few players? Leafs fans see them as extras that fans give away for really good players for some reason.

07 Aug 2018 16:36:35
I’d rather take that deal then pay Trouba 8 million.

07 Aug 2018 19:12:11
Islandjet
To start with all 3 of
Brown, Carrick, and Sparks will be RFAs not UFAs in 2yrs so you are wrong there.
Sparks won the equivalent of the Vezina in the AHL so he is far better than Comrie.
Carrick is a better suited number 3 RHanded Defenceman than Trouba is as the Jets are deep with Byfuglien and Myers ahead of Trouba.
Yes the Jets have great talent but the bottom 6 needs some depth.
Tanev, Copp, and Brown is a great 4th line for any Team and it only makes the Jets better in the end with this Trade.
Trouba is what the Leafs need to notch Hainsey down to make them solid on Defence.
As for the probable late 1st Round Pick many late 1st Round Picks have become star players so any 1st Round Pick means something.
Or maybe the Jets use that Pick to get the Center they need at some point to replace the departure of Stastny.
So to say the Jets won't bite with the Trouba contract problems etc doesn't wash as I see a fit for both Teams.

07 Aug 2018 21:34:16
The Jets wouldn’t take that deal whatsoever. Instead they need a top end prospect in return. My thoughts are proposing this:

WPG: Trouba
TOR: 1st Round Pick 2019, 2nd Round Pick 2020, Liljegren.

07 Aug 2018 21:48:16
Pinball,
From your own description of the trade, you're offering a bunch of depth pieces to the Jets.

Brown is a winger and the Jets have wingers galore, so no need for Brown. Goalies don't have much value at all. Carrick is a bottom pairing defenseman who may be able to play top 4 someday and a late first.

Nobody trades a young, top pairing RHD to get bottom 6 and bottom pairing depth. You would need to add a much more valuable piece.

So, the only fit here is for Toronto as there is absolutely no fit for Winnipeg.

07 Aug 2018 22:16:53
AJ01,
You're on the right track. However, the Jets wouldn't take an all futures trade. They would need a good, center or defenseman roster player coming back as well.

08 Aug 2018 01:56:18
Memarcusjoe I would prefer to get Lindgren, a 1st Round Pick 2019 and another mid range peice however I don’t see anyone I personally like. Maybe Gauthier as a centre but that’s it.

08 Aug 2018 01:57:09
So I’ll revise my trade

WPG: Trouba
TOR: Liljegren, Gauthier, 1st Round Pick 2019.

08 Aug 2018 05:37:06
AJ01,
That's why I think we're poor trading partners with Toronto. Their best available pieces all play positions the Jets don't need.

As for your Gauthier proposal, that would be selling really low on Trouba. 29 other teams would beat that offer easily.

08 Aug 2018 06:28:13
29 teams would out bid that offer 2 1st round picks and 2nd? . you think Carolina is going to pay more then that for another dman? You think Pittsburgh, Washington, Calargry or Nashville is going to destroy there cap space to take on another dman that they don’t need? Or you think teams like Detroit, Chicago, Montreal, Ottawa and New Jersey have the Assets to even make that type of offer. I bet many other teams wouldn’t be interested in him either.

@Memarcusjoe

Reread this nonsense before you post next time.

08 Aug 2018 14:35:10
Vbbb I really believe that there would be at least a dozen teams that would want Trouba and many of them have the cap space to pay him over $6 mil per. Detroit, Philly, Boston, NYI and Vegas have interest in trading for Trouba. I believe that Chevy will only trade him if they can't get a long term deal done before next season. This may be hastened if Poolman steps up and plays as he has done in the past. I agree with Memarcusjoe that the Leafs and Jets aren't good trading partners as what the Jets would want for Trouba the Leafs wouldn't trade.

08 Aug 2018 14:57:45
Vbbb,
We've all seen over the last few days how terrible you are at evaluating players by the amount of disagrees you get on your posts.

Young, top pairing RHD don't come on the market every day. There would be a bidding war for him.

Watch some hockey and try to learn a little bit about it before you post next time.

08 Aug 2018 22:52:05
Not that I agree with vbb’s Joe but you’re not new to this site, the disagrees mean absolutely nothing.

08 Aug 2018 23:45:22
Leafs17,
True. But he's also been ripped pretty good on his Leaf valuations by fellow Leaf fans the last few days. I guess what I'm getting at is that he is terrible at player values and bases his trade values on who he likes. If he likes the player or they are a shiny new toy, they are worth a ton, if he doesn't like them, they are almost worthless. He always has far too much bias in his evaluations to be taken seriously. So, he is the last guy to trust for objective trade valuation.

09 Aug 2018 04:25:43
I’m the one ripping him Joe. I’ve seen way too many years of the leafs being a bubble team or bottom feeder. I’m excited about their team now but you won’t here me saying much unless it’s in defense of a comment. I’ve been brought down to earth too many times thinking they had a real team. I still don’t think they’re contenders without a stud d man. I think Tampa, Boston and even Buffalo will have something to say about the leafs getting out of the first round again.

09 Aug 2018 06:12:21
I hear ya Leafs17. It was nice having a discussion with someone on this site that didn't turn into a bunch of childish ranting. It doesn't happen very often here.

07 Aug 2018 02:48:57
What do you think. Leafs 1st rounder going to be low IMO.

Most low firsts similar to high 2nds.

Gardiner+1st 2019

Faulk

Toronto gains an extra year of conteol on faulk that they wouldn't have on Gardiner. after this season Gardiner is going to be asking for 6years around 6milper. Which Toronto Cannot do. Carolina can. that immediately saves toronto around 1.2 mil off the top on next years cap where mattews . marners . and nylanders contracts are all active.

They can then Pair Faulk with Reilly on the. top pairing finally take Hainey get him qith carrick lr zaitsev on the 2nd or 3rd pair.

thoughts?

07 Aug 2018 05:16:54
All depends how leafs view Dermotts readiness for a bigger role. Right now Rielly and Gards on the left and only zaitsev as a natural RHD in the top 4. So this shifts that problem form R to L. If dermott steps up to take Gardiners spot which is possible, then it helps. But to be honest, Faulk isn’t the guy we need. He’s an upgrade on the RS, but I’d rather a really solid 2 way or just defensive guy to be Riellys long time partner. I think Rielly is good enough and smart enough that they could reign him into be the more stable guy beside Faulk as the rusher, but I think it’s better to leave Rielly doing what he’s become comfortable with and find him that Marc Methot type guy.

07 Aug 2018 05:23:48
Also I don’t think the pick needs to be a 1st to make up the difference but all depends how much they value the year of control. Gardiner might not interest Carolina withe their D already good enough to make Faulk expendable and if I were trading a top 4 d with a great cap hit plus a first, I’d want more than a top 4 D with a slightly higher cap hit back.

07 Aug 2018 10:36:54
Have you looked at Gardiners career stats compared to Faulks? Gardiners stats are much bwtter. No way they give extra.

07 Aug 2018 13:22:56
I think that's slightly misleading. Gardiner didn't turn a corner to score a round Faulks career average in points until about 2 years ago when the leafa forward corps really took off. And his points are assost driven. Faulk on the other hand is a goal scorer who had a down year this year, which was only 6 points lower than his career norm and would have tied Gardiner career high pre Mathews and Marner. Gardiner doesn't have better career numbers, Gardiner has better numbers since he got to work with Mathews Marner Nylander and Marleau and Faulks top forward was Skinner? And no real other offensive threat to help compliment him. Gardiner likely better on D, although ill be honest i'm not sure by how much or how to quantify it reliably. Faulk has extra year of control, right handed, and probably puts up better numbers than Gardiner if playing with the same level of offensive talent around him. that's why i personally would give Faulk more value than Gardiner, not sure how much more though. Regardless Carolina will he looking for forwards in a Faulk deal.

07 Aug 2018 14:10:50
Or is it because he is a leaf jbs? I could argue that throughout there careers Faulk has played on a better all round team. The leafs even though being good offensively are still wrak defensively. Gardiner is minus 10 in his career. Faulk is minus 109.

07 Aug 2018 14:42:37
@jbs. Fair enough. I didn’t say Gardiner is better. Said Faulk isn’t the right fit. Also o don’t believe the difference between them either way (whoever you feel is better) is a 1st rounder. That’s all.

07 Aug 2018 16:40:42
Faulk to Toronto just isn’t a good idea no Matter how you spin it. We need the exact opposite type of player.

08 Aug 2018 00:45:53
Look Cherry, I take offense to your comment. I am not a Leaf hater, I am just looking at facts. I have stated before how I think the Leafs D is better than people give credit, and I gthink a big part of that is people discounting Gardiner. Carolina has not been a better offensive team than Toronto since Gardiner came into the league. They were above Toronto in goals scored once, and it was by 4 goals. Faulk, however, has been above Gardiner in goals and points every year until the Leafs hit it big with Mathews and Marner, two players the likes of which Faulk has never been able to play with. +/ - is a team stat, when your team can't score you will look bad. When your goalie puts up 7 straight below average save % seasons, your +/ - will look bad no matter what you do defensively. I am not saying Faulk is a great defensive player, but his minus numbers are similar to Gardiners before Mathews Marner and Freddie came along as well. I don't disagree with people saying Leafs need a more defensive minded D, but Faulk isn't some scrub who can't hold Gardiners jock strap, and saying an extra cheap season, of a more offensively talented, RHD is more valuable really is not some big crazy hot take. I look stuff up before I post comparing players, I like to speak from an informed opinion, and try to look at more than just what's on paper as well. But I do not discredit a player based on the jersey they wear.

08 Aug 2018 20:40:29
My apologies jbs, just used to people overrating and underating other players strictly based on the jersey they wear. I do still disagree with you rating Faulk higher but I guess that is personal opinion. If you look at Pesce and Slavins stats they are plus players while Faulk is far into the negative so I think that negates the argument of the Carolina goalie being bad. I guess we have to agree to disagree. don't get me wrong though, neither will win any defensive awards.

Sorry if I offended you.

08 Aug 2018 23:26:21
I agree with you though doncherry. The only way that a guy with the same team around him should have that far worse +/ - is when he has to play against the top lines all the time and it’s obviously a lot tougher. But at home Bill Peters puts Slavin/ pesce out against top lines whenever he can because he has last change. Most of the time that Faulk faces top lines would be on the road and it’s because the home teams coach has identified he wants his top line against Faulk instead of Slavin/ pesce. I don’t dislike Faulk, he’s good at what he does and would be a great add to quite a few teams. But Toronto isn’t one of them.

09 Aug 2018 03:56:03
I overreacted so i apologize for that i just try hard to look at things from an unbiased stand point and have a ton of respect for how the Leafs have turned things around so quick. I won't argue Faulk is a better player than Gardiner because i don't think that's true, its just the other factors i stated above that i believe give him more trade value. I don't think anyone would argue slavin and pesce are top pair players and they were only +1 last year, which i feel proves my point on +/ -. Faulk isn't a great D player just likely not as abysmal as given credit.

07 Aug 2018 02:39:53
Its No Secret Toronto needs to Upgrade their Defence.

They should be doing this by any means Neccisary. And by not moving Mattews,Marner, or nylander .

Toronto IS going to be finishing high in the standings i'm decently confident on that. if there was ever a year to go for it this is it.
Trade that first round pick . Package it with Gardiner And Solidify the blueline.

Toronto Trades:
Jake Gardiner
1st Round Pick

Carolina Trades
Justin Faulk

It would be a +800k added to torontos cap . They also get a HUGE extra year of control out of faulk at a cheap 4.8M they woukdnt have with gardiner. On gardiners new deal he's going to want in the vacinity of 6M per on a 5-6 year minimum deal. which the leafs just can't do.

I think then taking Hainsey off the top pairing . and Pairing Faulk with Reilly, then moving Hainsey down with Carrick or Zaitsev. on the second or third pairing. I think that would really help not only solify their roster but help long term as well.

07 Aug 2018 06:43:12
Necessary*.

07 Aug 2018 22:31:21
Carolina needs wingers they are not just going to gift Toronto a better defenseman for a late 1st and Gardiner, try trading Nylander or marner for a stud dman.

06 Aug 2018 13:39:17
Carolina Trades
Faulk

Toronto Trades
Leivo
Holl (AHL)
2ND Round Pick 2019

The Caine's gave Skinner away for next to nothing maybe they bite on this..

Thoughts ?

06 Aug 2018 14:24:40
I would also add a 3RD Round Pick 2020 to make it similar to the Skinner Trade.

06 Aug 2018 14:39:18
Carolina can keep Faulk while the value may not be bad.

06 Aug 2018 17:54:57
These guys are 25 and 26 years old. Not sure why Carolina would want them as they have much better younger players that can fill any need those guys could. so essentially it's a 2nd for faulk and eventhough I'm not a huge fan of faulk he should get more then that. But it is don Waddell we are talking about here.

07 Aug 2018 02:54:12
There is such thing as a salary cap. Toronto can't just keep adding salary with term and expect to not create. log jam. They would have to give up Gardiner in any trade involving Faulk. Carolina would much prefer nylander. then toronto would have to sweeten the pot then add a 1st .

Making it
Gardiner and a 1st

For Faulk

toronto does add 800k this season but that's ok. its next season they're worried about. By not having to resign gardiner they actually save money next year .

This really makes to much sense not 5o have been atleast considered by toronto.

07 Aug 2018 04:52:27
Leafs have close to 15 million in Cap this Season. Nylander probably signs for 6 million a year like Ellers in Winnipeg then at the start of the Season you put Horton and his 5.3 million on LTIR and there is close to 9 million in Cap. Yes the Leafs can add to what they have even after Nylander is signed. So #DJP117 look up there Cap Space and see where the Leafs are at. They have plenty of Cap Space.

07 Aug 2018 05:21:00
Pinball he means because Faulk is into next season too. Meaning that $9mill + the few mill that come off the books from hainsey etc is going to be spent on Matthews and marners raises. They’re ont have $4.5mill or whatever extra unless they are letting gardiners 4.05 mill walk.

07 Aug 2018 10:49:31
Faulk is minus 109 on his career. Not what Toronto needs. Rather keep Gardiner.

07 Aug 2018 13:28:29
+/ - is a terrible stat that is influenced by his teammates that have not been good since he got there and a goalie that posted below average save percentages for 7 straight seasons. In fact i believe Carolina gave up on of the fewest amounts of shots in the league but were bottom 6 in goals against.

07 Aug 2018 14:39:19
So Slavin and Pesce, who both had the same goaltender for the last few years are both plus hockey players. So Ward only played bad in front of Faulk?

07 Aug 2018 15:54:03
Yeah, the stats do point towards Faulks defensive lapses. I think it’s more likely that ward/ darling/ whoever struggled to stop pucks more with Faulk on the ice because he gave up better scoring chances against than it is likely thatthebhoalies just played better every shift the other pairing came over the boards. Faulk is a great skater and has some skills built for today game, but he’s not the guy for the leafs unless they get a really solid Defensive player to pair him with.

05 Aug 2018 16:41:32
Ducks Trade
Montour

Leafs Trade
Connor Brown
Borgman
1st Round Pick 2019

Thoughts ?

05 Aug 2018 17:23:06
Classic Pinball.

05 Aug 2018 21:05:22
Anaheim laughs at this and never bothers dealing with us again LOL.

04 Aug 2018 16:55:05
Minnesota Trades
Niederreiter
Spurgeon

Toronto Trades
Connor Brown
Liljegren
Sparks
1st Round Pick 2019

Thoughts ?

04 Aug 2018 17:50:44
‘Pinball. Is. Back. ’

*cold shivers*.

04 Aug 2018 19:02:33
i don't see them giving up on lilegren this early, i see him as a solid top 4 in a couple years for them.

04 Aug 2018 20:16:07
Leafs take this for sure.

05 Aug 2018 17:20:28
Ya and Minnesota doesn’t ya hope the Liljegren can be half the player spurgeon is and nino is better then a late first a bum brown and sparks.

 
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