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05 Feb 2019 17:49:49
3 way trade

Leafs trade Gardiner, 1st (2020), pick/ prospect
Leafs receive Pesce

Avs trade 1st, 2nd
Avs receive Gardiner

Carolina trades Pesce
Carolina receives 2x1st, 2nd, pick/ prospect

If you don’t think Pesce is worth all that, simply remove whatever excess Toronto is paying above value. The concept remains the same: Leafs manage to convert Gardiner into Pesce.

Why Leafs make the trade: the lose Gardiner’s and gain Pesce. Pretty straightforward.

Why Avs make this trade: Sakic must be panicking seeing the team slide out of playoffs. A move like this is not out of question. Avs have the extra picks they can afford this no problem.

Why Carolina makes this trade: they have so many defensemen, and looking to re-build on the fly, this move gives them a lot of picks they could really use.

LeafsGM

1.) 05 Feb 2019 18:39:14
Pesce is worth Gardiner and a 1st? I don't think so.


2.) 05 Feb 2019 21:14:27
To carolina he's worth more then that I'd say. They have zero need for gardiner as he is a pending ufa that chances are wouldn't sign there anyway. And even if he did they already have hamilton faulk slavin who are each just as good or better then gardiner we'll he might be slightly better then faulk. But anyway unless Carolina has another deal in place to trade gardiner again for something really good they don't make this trade.


3.) 05 Feb 2019 21:16:52
Ok I think I have figured out what you wrote there carolina gets 2 1st a 2nd and a prospect and another pick for pesce. yeah I'd do that.


4.) 05 Feb 2019 22:45:08
I don't think avs trade a 1rst that could be a top 10 at this point for ufa gardiner.


5.) 06 Feb 2019 10:04:36
It's funny if you go to the leafs boards they actually pat each other on the backs for these type of proposals.


6.) 07 Feb 2019 16:26:32
Avs will not trade any of his 1st round picks.
Sakic knows that his team is too young right now to compete va winnipeg and nashville.
With this two 1st round and probably 1 or second overall pick, they will have an impact player + timmins + Makar. So he will wait 2 years and his team will fight for stanley cup.


 

 

16 Dec 2018 05:06:24
Leafs trade Gardiner + Brown
Columbus trades Carlsson, 1st + Milano, Abramov

Maybe Dubas wants to try and get something for Gardiner still. Dermott looks outstanding and can easily take on the extra duties and minutes playing 2LHD.

All the suggested incoming players are young, cheap, and last I read, were all still ranked quite highly.

LeafsGM

1.) 16 Dec 2018 15:55:58
Clb says no easily.


2.) 16 Dec 2018 17:08:25
I don’t see Leafs making this either to be honest. If they are trading roster players, will be wanting immediate replacements to help for playoffs.

Just trying to get a feel for what these guys are all worth is all. Leafs have incentive to move both these guys, and Columbus could use them both. Especially if they see themselves as competitive and looking to add offense for playoffs.


3.) 16 Dec 2018 17:40:26
@isthatright

What do you feel is the sticking point about this trade that makes Columbus reject? Abramov looks good. I can understand if Columbus doesn’t want to trade him. But I don’t think either Milano or Carlsson are working out as well as Columbus had hoped. They may be willing to part with them for some immediate help heading into playoffs.

Again. I think Toronto keeps Gard’s and Brown unless they get something for this year in return. Leafs are in “win now” mode. I’m just getting a feel for what all these guys are worth is all.


4.) 16 Dec 2018 17:52:09
Don’t see why Columbus gives away 4 good young controllable assets for another guybthey can watch walk out the door with Bobrovsky and panarin. If it’s with a very team friendly extension, maybe. But even then if Gardiner was willing to sign an ‘extremely team friendly contract’ he would stay in Toronto.


5.) 16 Dec 2018 18:49:43
So you don’t think Columbus feels they are competitive enough to take on a rental then Jim?


6.) 17 Dec 2018 21:15:03
Not at that price, no. If puck moving D was their only glaring problem, maybe. But They have good defence.


 

 

13 Dec 2018 18:26:53
Leafs trade Dermott
Avs trade Makar

Everyone seems to think we could afford Pietrangelo next year, so instead we re-sign Gardiner to same cost as Pietrangelo and trade out Dermott. We still have Sandin in the system.

2019/ 2020

Rielly/ Liljegren
Gardiner/ Zaitsev
Hainsey/ Ozhiganov
(Sandin/ Makar)

LeafsGM

1.) 13 Dec 2018 18:47:30
I don't see why the Leafs would trade a D-man for a D-man (they should be looking to trade a forward for a D-man as they are deeper up front than they are on the back-end) .

I suppose they could trade a D-Man that they don't think they will be able to resign (Gardiner) for another D-Man (one that is more affordable, still under contract, etc. ) but Colorado would likely (and rightfully) laugh at that sort of proposal.

I have not watched Dermott much but have read good things, and given that he's dirt cheap still I think the Leafs will be banking on him. They signed Rosen to a cheap extension (and he is having a terrific year in the AHL), so assuming Gardiner prices himself out of Toronto, they would have Rielly, Dermott and Rosen on the LHS next year.


2.) 13 Dec 2018 18:59:18
No from Colorado.


3.) 13 Dec 2018 18:59:54
Doesnt make sense for the Leafs or the Avs. makar is a highend prospect projected to be top 2 quality. Leafs are looking for players to help now. No from both sides.


4.) 13 Dec 2018 19:05:37
Just thinking it would be nice if we could keep the forward group intact, and rather than lose Gardiner for nothing to free agency, we extend him, and trade from LHD to address RHD. Gardiner is having another great year. Babcock thinks highly of him, and rightfully so. And with Rosen and Sandin still in the system, our left side is much stronger than our right side. It’s a little different than most of the proposals floated lately. A little outside the box. Looking ahead a couple years: Rielly/ Makar Gardiner/ Liljegren would be a very effective top 4. Maybe one of the best in the league.


5.) 13 Dec 2018 19:40:35
Gardiner would have to take a huge discount to stay. I don’t see him wanting to do that and I don’t blame him. He will have a few options at least and can cash in. Why I would keep dermott is that he’s so much younger, a great skater as well (which is gardiners biggest asset) and a hometown kid.

When Don cherry used to harp on the leafs for not having enough ontario boys on the team I thought it was overrated and I don’t care where a player comes from as long as they’re good and they play hard for the Leafs. But when now it comes to cap situation, it’s a lot easier to ask hometown kids who grew up leaf fans to leave money on the table to play for the leafs than a Minnesota kid, an Arizona kid or a Stockholm kid.
Kadri, Connor Brown and Zach Hyman signed low cost multi year deals just to stay in the city longer. Now if you can get that out of dermott, hopefully some kind of discount from marner etc, it helps. They should Keep dermott.


6.) 13 Dec 2018 19:42:13
LeafsGM you constantly bash Gardiner and now you say this, wtf?


7.) 13 Dec 2018 20:33:17
@leafs17

To be honest, I was a huge fan of Gardiner until Game 7, and then turned against him. I mean, sure, it’s entertaining to poke fun at Gardiner and make jokes about how he can’t skate backwards, but at the end of the day the truth is that he is a very good player. A near-elite offensive defenseman, he’s probably the most improved player under Babcock. I’m not so blinded by resentment for one bad game that i can’t see truth, and the truth is that he is a very valuable player, and if we could afford him, then it wouldn’t most definitely be in Leafs best interest to re-sign him. Unfortunately, I have a hard time seeing it happen.


8.) 13 Dec 2018 22:13:30
They have no choice but to let Gardiner walk IMO. Dermott can fill the void and there are much bigger players to sign. I don’t follow the prospects too much, just the odd article and what you guys say. Does anyone think Liljegren or Sandin will be ready next year?


9.) 13 Dec 2018 23:12:26
I don’t understand why you would sign Gardiner for the same price that Petro would get like that doesn’t make any sense considering Gardiner is no where near the quality of Petro.
Also that’ll be an immediate no coming from Colorado why would they trade Makar for a lesser potential dman.
Just Keep Dermott.


10.) 14 Dec 2018 00:16:59
@Mcjesus, I think his thoughts process was that Gardiner would stay for 5 years at $6-6.5 mill as where petro is only making that next year, then will be $8+. I agree with you though. Let Jake walk if he doesn’t want to stay for like $5 mill. Dermott in my opinion looks like he’s ready for top 4 min on that left side, little less offense but will probably be better all round than Gardiner. With Rielly and all those forwards we can sacrifice a few pts from Gardiner to have a more all round guy making far less.


11.) 14 Dec 2018 00:53:50
@leafs17

I’m really hoping Liljegren will be ready for next year. From what I’ve read, he’s doing pretty good. But Sandin apparently has been doing outstanding. Much further ahead than expected. Extremely high hockey IQ. It’s quite possible they both make the team next year, and we may even see a bit of Liljegren this year. Of course I’m only reading the same articles as everyone else, so I can only rely on news reports, which may be hyped.

Dermott looks fantastic. He’s on pace for over 20 points playing 3rd line. Possession metrics are outstanding at 55% CF. Given more ice time this year and has responded by playing even better this year than last. No sign of a so-called “sophomore slump” there. It makes the decision to let Gardiner walk end of season much easier for management I’m sure.


12.) 14 Dec 2018 03:33:16
I hope to to see Liljegren this year before they make a big trade for a RD. I know the experience is not there but maybe adding a veteran defenseman at the deadline would be better than trading a piece of the core away if Liljegren could be ready next year on an ELC.


13.) 14 Dec 2018 05:35:24
Gardiner is a very underrated player. Years of underperformance have left fans with a distorted view of his actual value today. Compare Gardiner vs Pietrangelo since 2016-2017 to present. Almost identical stats. Very eerily how similar they are in fact. The difference between the two players now seems to be more the intangible things that Pietrangelo brings to his team that Gardiner cannot. Things like leadership, media relations, community outreach, team development. All very valuable qualities that make Pietrangelo a qualified captain deserving of a pay premium over Gardiner.

Jim was correct as well in that I was referring to the extensions. Gardiner tops out about $6.5-$7.0, while Pietrangelo, assuming he has a bounce back year next year, will likely command $8.5-$9.5. A fairly significant difference.


14.) 14 Dec 2018 14:06:38
If someone gives pietrangelo 8.5-9.5 it'll be a huge mistake. Maybe I guess on a 2 or 3 year deal but he seems to be regressing already. see later I guess. Think that's a huge anchor, be untradable for years.


15.) 14 Dec 2018 16:17:21
@shoots

Even before he was injured, I read a few articles basically saying the same thing: That Pietrangelo was having a disappointing season on a team full of disappointments.

After he returns from injury, it will be interesting to see if he can play at his full potential again. Karlsson never didn’t return to form after he got hurt.

I think it’s still a little early to say whether Pietrangelo is regressing. No matter how the rest of the season goes, this year gives a distorted view. But next year should really give us a better idea of what he is capable of and how much he is worth.


16.) 14 Dec 2018 17:21:34
Ya, agree, just to many players get signed past their prime to big money contracts for 6-8 years. Would be fine with 3 years at big money but look at players like lucic, backes, Seabrook. Think teams will smarten up soon cause getting to be a lot of those players in the league now. Shouldn't be rocket science to not sign a 30 year to a 8 year contract unless takes a nice discount on the money.


17.) 14 Dec 2018 20:12:15
You nailed it Shoots.

Even understanding that there are more and more guys playing until they are 40, and playing good hockey at that, guys like Jagr, Marleau, Thornton, etc, are still the exception.

You would have thought GM’s learned their lessons long time ago, what with the spectacular failures in, say, NYI, for example, with Yashin and DiPietro. But that doesn’t appear to be the case. Chicago buried themselves with all those long term deals and are going to have a difficult time digging out from under those boat anchor contracts.

As long as the Leafs don’t make the same silly mistakes I don’t really care what other teams do though. Lol.


18.) 15 Dec 2018 04:22:29
Ya, some players are worth it but not many. Guys with as many miles as the three players I mentioned don't usually get better with age. Some as Giordano get better with age but play a type of game that eases the body more. Physical players seem to slow down a lot earlier. Patrick kane probably be one of those guys that can play along time cause doesn't take a lot of abuse and Thornton a big dude but seems to avoid contact for a big guy. Think Chicago should've traded Seabrook before a fa or let him walk. didn't have much defensive help but better than signing him for 8 years. Bowman made a mistake on that. A Chicago fan and as much as like him, 8 years not a good signing. But paying him for what he's done, not what he's going to do.


 

 

06 Dec 2018 02:42:32
Leafs trade Zaitsev, Brown, 3rd
NYR trade Shattenkirk (retain $2M), Strome

Basically we are sitting the difference in salary. NY saves just over $1.15M and Leafs add about the same. All the benefits about Pinball’s trade still apply. Leafs give NY an upgrade on wing and the pick because they are taking on Zaitsev, whose contract is a lot longer than Shattenkirk’s.

LeafsGM

1.) 06 Dec 2018 05:15:39
is brown really an upgrade? i like brown but idk why the rangers would do this, they're trying to rebuild and they'll be better by that time, doesn't make sense.


2.) 06 Dec 2018 05:46:42
Honestly, I wouldn’t do it. Call it homerism if you want. The difference between shattenkirk and zaitsev is real, but not very big. Then consider that shattenkirk is not defensive and I would say zaitsev is better for what we need, younger and signed cheaper. Shattenkirk, after leaving St. Louis, was exposed as what he is. A pp guy who is closer to a 6th Dman than a top pair at even strength. Even when Barry Trotz was asked about caps not resigning him after having him for the playoff run he said something along the lines of “I was under the impression we were adding a top pair Dman, that wasn’t the case”. I’m very satisfied having zaitsev at $4.5 mill to be a good solid #4 Dman. Now fill in around him dermott and Rielly. Don’t make lateral moves to bring in an older more expensive guy we don’t need.


Leaf fans are prepared to let Jake Gardiner walk after the season because he’s an offense first guy who takes risks and makes mistakes and they don’t want to pay him the $6.5Mill+ that he will command. So why give assets to get shattenkirk who makes $6.65 and does that same thing from the other side?!


3.) 06 Dec 2018 13:23:49
I don’t want anything to do with Shattenkirk. He’s not the d man the leafs need. Brown could be packaged with a 1st and a prospect to get a defense first d man.


4.) 06 Dec 2018 14:04:27
The only reason for making this trade would be to get out of Zaitsev’s contract earlier. I split the cost by having Rangers retain salary, so Shattenkirk and Zaitsev cost the same in this proposal. Is Shattenkirk better than Zaitsev? Questionable. But we get out from under Zaitsev’s contract in half the time if you are unsatisfied with him, while bringing in an equally qualified replacement. Shattenkirk plays 2RHD on Leafs. I feel more comfortable having him for call up to 1st line than Zaitsev if Hainsey gets hurt. A rebuilding Rangers team get a good young player in Brown, stability in the back end with Zaitsev’s contract, and a pick to help them rebuild. If Strome isn’t the guy they want to send our way, we can take someone else. I just threw Strome in to match salaries easier.

It’s a fairly neutral trade. The only reason for making this trade is to get out from under Zaitsev’s contract a little earlier. It’s not one I would entertain seriously normally, but felt there was some merit to Pinball’s proposal. He makes some very good points, and I took it upon myself to see if there was a way that a Zaitsev/ Shattenkirk trade could make sense. I enjoy floating proposals like this. It’s fun for one thing, and you learn a lot more about the players and teams in the process.


5.) 06 Dec 2018 21:01:05
I don’t really care about getting out of zaitsevs deal early. He’s a very capable player. Great skater, struggled last year with injuries and other personal things and looks a lot better this year. $4.5 mill is fine for a second pair guy and it’s going to be even more reasonable as top tier guys get $10+, these guys will be $6 mill guys soon enough.


6.) 06 Dec 2018 21:11:05
there is no reason to make this trade unless TOR is admitting That Zaitsev is a really bad defender.


 

 

29 Nov 2018 05:39:59
Leafs trade Marner, Kadri, Gardiner, 2x1st
St. Louis trades Tarasenko, Pietrangelo, Husso, Thomas

Marleau/ Matthews/ Nylander
Hyman/ Tavares/ Tarasenko
Johnsson/ Thomas/ Kapanen
Lindholm/ Gauthier/ (Leivo)

Rielly/ Pietrangelo
Dermott/ Zaitsev
Hainsey/ Ozhiganov
(Sandin/ Liljegren)

LeafsGM

1.) 29 Nov 2018 06:24:08
Are you high.

You want a 40 goal scorer, our young 1c potential center, our best defenseman elite top 10 Dman, and our best goalie prospect for

Marner and crap.

Stupid bad.


2.) 29 Nov 2018 07:18:29
Big changes coming to St. Louis.

Marner ~ Tarasenko
Kadri > Thomas + Husso
Gardiner + 2x1st = Pietrangelo

I forgot Brown somewhere, you guys can have him too.

Kadri is 30 goal scorer, 60+ points. A far superior player to Thomas, he helps St. Louis immediately and at low cost.

Gardiner is near-elite offensive defenseman on pace for over 40 points again himself. Hardly crap.

Brown is a solid depth player that can get 15-20 goals and 30+ points. Hardly crap.

The first are what they are.

St. Louis is in a world of hurt. Trading Thomas and Husso doesn’t even affect them. They lose Tarasenko and Pietrangelo, who they might lose anyway since they are so tight against cap I have difficult time seeing them re-sign him.

All those moves in the summer. All that money spent, and they still suck. This trade gives them an injection of offense right away and some futures to go with.


3.) 29 Nov 2018 09:16:37
Leafs add Mathews, then maybe it's fair.


4.) 29 Nov 2018 09:29:10
@redwing

Jake Gardiner
Rank#31, 49.2%, 1G8, 9a, 10pts, +4, 24blk, 26hits, 14tk, 24gv

Pietrangelo
Rank#30, 48%cf, 4g, 6a, 10pts, -6, 58blk, 20 hit, 16tk, 16gv

And it’s not just this year either. Gardiner and Pietrangelo have had almost identical stats the last three years.

Kadri is everything St. Louis hopes Thomas will be. An outstanding player and on a team friendly contract. It’s not like Thomas has been setting any records or is even a Calder candidate.

There’s actually a lot going for this trade. You get immediate and significant help up front, you shore up LD, which is really weak, plus you get futures to replace your prospects.

But coming from someone who thinks Parayko is worth Nylander + Sandin + Liljegren, I’m not surprised by your flippant attitude. Maybe I could take you more seriously if you actually had realistic expectations about what your players are worth.


5.) 29 Nov 2018 10:58:30
Wouldn’t trade Marner alone for that. Marner>>>>Mathews and Tavares.


6.) 29 Nov 2018 11:12:09
Marner> Tarasenko

Kadri> Thomas

Pietro>Gardiner

2 first>>>>>>Husso

I'm the biggest leafs hater on this site hands down, but even I see how this is in favor of St Louis if anything. Marner is worth . ore then Tarasenko based on aged.


7.) 29 Nov 2018 12:37:44
This is stupid.


8.) 29 Nov 2018 12:56:41
Nah colt, come on, you only see things from the Blues pov and can't see that the rest of the package ain't ‘crap’. Naz is worth more than Thomas, petros worth more than gardiner, the two 1sts kinda make up the diff and by now, marner and senko are a wash, hell, with age and production, people may take marner.


9.) 29 Nov 2018 13:24:11
Boom boom I think a couple others may have you beat on that claim. I don’t know a lot about Thomas and Husso but you admitted yourself colt that you are a homer. Kadri is far from crap, add in his cap hit makes him that much more valuable. I’m a StLouis fan, I actually thought they’d be contenders this year but something has to change.


10.) 29 Nov 2018 14:33:44
the fact you don't know a lot about Thomas shows your ignorance.

petro is top 10 dman in league. Elite dman.
Tarasenko is a 40 goal scorer
Thomas is one of the highest rated center prospects/ rookies. Former ppg in ohl, Ohl playoff mvp and made the nhl at 19.
Husso best goalie prospect the blues have highly rated.

So basically you want to gut the blues best defenseman, best scorer, Best center prospect and best goalie prospect for A ufa defenseman (who sucks at defense), A glorified 2c, Marner (only thing worth anything) and 2 29-31st late round firsts.

That's a solid hell no. Yeah I am a homer. Name one person on this site that isn't. Honestly you cant. This trade is bad for the blues. If you are rebuilding, Which isn't the case yet, You don't trade your top prospects and rookie centers for old people and picks. You just don't do that.

You want to Do petro for marner or tarasenko for marner. Then you can argue that. But late round firsts, ufas and old 2cs are not needed. Don't sit here and claim your offer makes sense when it doesnt.


11.) 29 Nov 2018 14:37:57
want to make a trade that helps blues and Leafs here you go.

Parayko, Kostin, jaybo, 3rd

for

Kapenan, Sandin, Liljgren

There don't be a homer. Blues get young redundant player now have room to sign nylander. Get the top pairing young dman with term. and a 3rd pick. Blues also get two young good d prospects that will help fill the void parayko causes.


Keep the rest of the crap out of the trade. Either blues make hockey trade to shake it up a bit which means its even both ways or they blow up and rebuild. Both of these scenarios don't include getting redundant pieces or ufas, (kadri, Gardnier)


12.) 29 Nov 2018 15:07:51
You are funny Colt. I tKe Marner anyday. And funny, a coach who loves defensive dmen loves Gardiner. I wonder why. And you include jbo in an offer. Talk about useless.


13.) 29 Nov 2018 15:54:03
Also in what world would you have Tarasenko on the second line under nylander who hasn't played a game yet this season. This alone only shows how delusional you really are.


14.) 29 Nov 2018 16:00:27
I didn’t propose the deal or say it was fair, therefore me saying I don’t know a lot about Thomas is honest, not ignorant. . I just said that you’re a homer, which you admitted yourself. I also said Kadri is not crap. Don’t let colt come out, you’re much nicer as redwing. I also said I’m a fan of StLouis.


15.) 29 Nov 2018 16:30:10
Show me one web site where Pietrangelo is rated top 10. Because right off the top of my head I can think of at least 12-15 guys who are better.

Maybe if you can back up your claims I would be able to take you more serious. Right now you’re just blowing hot air.


16.) 29 Nov 2018 17:44:06
Jaybo was added as dead weight that would fall off at the end of the year. If we were taking Nylander. But in general.


17.) 29 Nov 2018 18:52:55
Did I specifically call you out. If you think Petro isn't top ten or you are saying he isn't elite, then your high brah. Blowing hot air, yeah ok. This proposal sucks, It would never happen. Petro is top 10 in the league, He may be having an off year but 1 year out of 9 years doesn't demean his value. I found 4 sites in 5 minutes where alex p was in top ten. So your just a bias idiot. At least I can admit it.

Hockey news has him ranked 9th
https://goo.gl/uBSLaQ

wosports.com has him ranked 5th
https://goo.gl/KZjV88

NHL18 ratings Alex P 10th
https://goo.gl/Z4Q4Yh

NHL network top 20 nhl dmen Alex P 9th
https://goo.gl/1m23qW


18.) 29 Nov 2018 19:45:35
Okay, you did what he asked and found some examples but I’m still laughing at NHL18 ratings being a source. First of all it’s a video game, secondly it would be a year and a half old. And the one list you put has Ryan Suter at #2 ahead of doughty. enough said.


19.) 29 Nov 2018 19:52:56
So leafsGM do you take what you said back. Are you going to admit i was right?

Also Leafs17 if you think this trade is fair then you are a homer as well. At least i can admit i am. In all honesty every person on this site is bias towards their team if you say you are not then you are Bias and a liar.


20.) 29 Nov 2018 19:59:24
Also, if you think one bad year doesn’t demean a great players value, just ask the Ottawa Senators and ask Erik Karlsson, because I’ve watched him play 6 or 7 times this season and after getting an underwhelming trade return, I’m not so sure the 8x $11 mill he was offered in Ottawa will still be there for him in July because he’s been far below average by his standards. He was right at or near the top of all those lists you presented.

I like Petro and think he’s an elite Dman but the package in this trade is not all crap as you suggest. However this trade is so far fetched that it doesn’t really matter what the return was, it’s not going to happen.

Still using EA Sports NHL player ratings as a source cracked me up though, so thank you 😊.


21.) 29 Nov 2018 20:34:43
I’d do the Kappanen trade in a heartbeat.


22.) 29 Nov 2018 21:29:57
Those lists are also outdated. All of them projections and were assembled before season starts. NHL. com is where I got my rankings from as well. It’s updated on a weekly bases and reflects current performance standards. Not expectations. So even the NHL list you provided here is meaningless.


23.) 29 Nov 2018 21:31:20
I can’t believe you used a hockey game for reference. Lmao.


24.) 30 Nov 2018 00:35:26
I grabed the fits four articles that posted. You asked me to find 1 and i did. Lol your such a tool you can't even admit when your wrong. Lol

Keep dreaming, hope your defense holds up. best of luck.


25.) 29 Nov 2018 21:22:10
I had like 5 mins left on lunch literally all four of those were in the first search. I am sure if i had time i could produce more. But NHL and Hockeywriters rankings are legit which he was respectively 9 and 10 in. Also ottowa Screwed the pooch, Alienated him and wouldn't pay him what he deserved, They also didn't get value for hoffman. So is that the market or dorian being an idiot.


 

 

 

LeafsGM's talk posts with other poster's replies to LeafsGM's talk posts

 

05 Jan 2019 04:49:59
It’s been almost 20 games. Schmaltz and Strome are looking real good on their new teams. As seamless transition as they get. This could really be a win-win situation here for both teams. And if Perlini can bounce back, Chicago might have a homerun.

LeafsGM

1.) 06 Jan 2019 05:10:28
Yeah I'm still leaning toward a home run for the hawks.


2.) 06 Jan 2019 21:02:24
I haven’t watched him much but Perlini is a big power forward, energy guy and I think it was a good throw in for Chicago.


3.) 07 Jan 2019 19:25:19
I think perlini will be a 20 goal man when he gets settled into his role. nice throw in indeed.


4.) 10 Jan 2019 08:22:26
I think they had to throw Perlini in. Strome wasn’t doing much, while Schmaltz was doing great. If Strome busted in Chicago and they didn’t get the extra body as insurance, that trade could have been the last straw before Chicago post a want ad for GM.


 

 

14 Dec 2018 03:35:00
Still a little early to tell, but looking at Strome’s production since going to Chicago, you got to think this is a classic case of a change of scenery is what was needed to get this guy going. And Schmaltz is doing exceptionally well in Arizona. Perlini not so good lol. But at this point, it’s looking like that was a trade that was beneficial to both teams. Maybe Strome lives up to his potential now?

LeafsGM

1.) 14 Dec 2018 06:56:15
Still too early man.


 

 

12 Dec 2018 04:37:47
Oh. Why would you say that yupp? Sandin is only 18 and playing in the AHL and is performing magnificently. Makar is 20 and playing collegiate.

Two years younger than Makar and playing at a much higher compete level. From reports I’ve been reading Sandin could be in NHL next year, while Makar is still developing.

LeafsGM

1.) 12 Dec 2018 12:05:51
Sandins underlying numbers are average, which is far from bad for an 18 year old in the AHL, but no playing in the AHL because you were drafted from Europe does not make you equal to a much higher drafted/ value/ ceiling prospect especially 20 games in.


2.) 12 Dec 2018 12:37:08
Mertle helped explain.
Don't see them trading him for a sideways deal for another prospect two years younger. If they trade him maybe it's for a couple years older D man in the league right now before just swapping prospects. They are very very high on him, that's why they selected him 4th overall.
When is the last time we've seen a top five draft pick prospect traded before even playing in the NHL. Maybe a few times but I can't even think of any right now. Teams like to keep their top prospects and home grow them how they want. That's why they pick them.
Just saying, I think to Colorado, Their own Makar has more value to them.


3.) 12 Dec 2018 16:15:44
Avs may say no, but this is hardly a laugher as yupp suggests below is my point. Sandin’s numbers may be average, but he is hardly an average player. Not sure what being from Sweden has to do with anything, but the fact is that Sandin is almost five years younger than the average age for a player in the AHL, and is playing in the second highest compete level outside the NHL. Makar is doing well in collegiate, playing against players his own age, and credit has to be given where due. But draft position is irrelevant, and both players project about the same. Until these guys are playing together on equal compete level, a comparison between them is difficult and meaningless. Only time will tell who the better player will be.


4.) 12 Dec 2018 17:48:22
@LeafsGM, draft position doesn’t matter down the road. Like saying Benn was a 5th rounder so he's worth less than someone who was in the 1st round is insane. But when it’s so recent, it matters. Because it’s what those teams just invested in them. Avs used a 4th overall on a Makar when they had their pick of just about anyone. The next year, when Sandin went 29th, Colorado had the 16th pick. So if they value him even close to as much as Makar, they would have taken him at 16th and had them both. Draft position isn’t always important but when you’re talking about a draft that was literally months ago, it matters. You’re right that draft position doesn’t guarantee success or who will be the better player when re-evaluates years later, but today when talking about an 18 year old and a 19 year old, it needs to be considered. No one was shocked that Dylan Strome was traded because of how good or bad of a player she he’s been, it was shocking because he was such a recent 3rd overall.


5.) 12 Dec 2018 19:19:29
@LeafsGM being from Sweden matters because Makar couldn’t play in the AHL until he’s 20, it’s against the rules. Sandin can because he was drafted out of Europe. So saying he’s better because he’s in the AHl at 18 is a bit of a misnomer, Makar couldn’t and he took the collegiate route instead of junior. Metrics show that’s Sandins play has been WORSE than his numbers show, again far from bad but not what he’s being pumped up to be. Still showing better than expected but it’s still a small sample size. You can’t say a quarter or a third of the way through the season that Sandin is now on Makars level and that their career projections are on the same trajectory, way too soon to see that big of a jump.


6.) 12 Dec 2018 20:09:15
@JBS, you’re right that it doesn’t mean Sandin is better, I agree. And as I said above, Sandin doesn’t get us Makar. But I don’t think where they were drafted from prevents them from playing in the AHL in this case. Sandin is allowed to play in the AHL even tho he was drafted from SSm of the OHL because he was on loan there from Sweden. However the agreement you’re talking about is the NHL-CHL agreement. MAkar never played in the CHL. He was in the Bchl Jr A player already committed to the NCAA, not the WHL. As soon as he’s a collegiate player he can leave school and turn pro anytime he wants, AHL or NHL, he can just never go back to his NCAA team. He’s ineligible. So the Avs, his family, his agent or whoever feels college is best for him and his development right now, but red tape rules are not keeping him from the AHL.


7.) 12 Dec 2018 21:32:25
Fair enough, he was loaned and not signed by SSM, I know that CHL teams keep collegiate players rights, so was thinking maybe they were still prevented from going pro as long as they had CHL rights, while European players have different rules. Like Tampa could have sent Lipanov to AHL because he wasn’t drafted into CHL under after they drafted him into the NHL.


8.) 12 Dec 2018 22:29:17
@jbs,

Do you know if there is anything in the rule books preventing international players from enrolling and playing at the collegiate level? That’s actually what a I thought you were getting at in the original post.


9.) 13 Dec 2018 01:03:29
@jbs, yeah it doesn’t matter if someone drafts you to the CHL. Just if you report and play there. Most Top players are drafted by CHL teams whether they have any intentions of playing there or not.

For example Patrick Kane had made it known he was staying in the states and going NCAA route, but London drafted him in the 5th round just incase he changed his mind. He did and they got a steal. Same thing happened with Eichel but in the Q (because he was East US) and Halifax drafted him late. He could Have been on the Mooseheads memorial cup team with mackinnon and Drouin. And then someone out west owned Auston Matthews CHL rigts, I want to say seattle but can’t remember for sure.


10.) 13 Dec 2018 02:22:32
Just going to say there are multiple better leagues then the AHL. KHL for sure. SHL And DEL are better imo.


11.) 13 Dec 2018 03:34:09
It’s pretty hard to determine which leagues are better. However AHL, from rules, to ice size to coaching and structure style is a carbon copy of the NHL. Obviously the NHL is another level skill and speed wise, but that’s why playing good in the AHL as a young Dman is a good measuring stick.


12.) 13 Dec 2018 03:42:06
I don’t think there’s anything stopping international players from playing collegiate, but they don’t seem to. Most can probably play pro in Europe if they don’t want to play CHL or even before, I know Cernak was playing men’s pro in Czech at 16 before coming over to Eerie. I know all North American are taken in CHL draft but with import rules in CHL I thought maybe they got some special treatment on going pro since there are fewer opportunities. Regardless, AHL is one of the best leagues outside the NHL (debatable imo between AHL and KHL) and Sandin even being average is a great sign for his future just think it’s too early for a huge value jump.


13.) 13 Dec 2018 04:13:02
Ok. I see. Sweet. Thanks to both you and Jim for clearing that up. It makes more sense now. So I have another question maybe yourself or Jim can answer: Is it just me, or does it seem like more and more athletes are taking the collegiate route to the big leagues? Aside from the obvious benefits an education brings, is there any other reason in terms of professional development that you can see would be an advantage of going the ncaa way?


14.) 13 Dec 2018 12:17:48
I personally don’t. I’ve always seen it as more a US thing, like American players are more likely to go collegiate probably in part so they don’t have to move to another country. I’m theory you’re playing against some bigger and stronger players as well, since collegiate players can play a few extra years. I feel colleges have a little bit less depth skill wise than juniours, but that seems to be changing so really it’s a preference thing I think. My favourite team is just now getting a decent number of collegiate players so I haven’t really looked at it terribly close to be honest.


15.) 13 Dec 2018 16:2:10
Jim. Without doubt you are my favourite contributor to this site. I know I’ve said that before, but it’s worth mentioning again. Almost every day I learn something new from you. You really are an absolute wealth of knowledge. And you are mature enough to be able to correct people without making them feel insecure or attempting to make yourself seem superior in the process. A trait not seen often enough on this forum.

Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot more young prospect players are choosing to go the collegiate route these days? I’m not sure if there is an advantage to that or not. What is your take on that one Jim? Outside of gaining an education and all the obvious benefits associated with that, with regards to a players professional development in terms of the sport is there any real advantage with going through the collegiate route?


16.) 13 Dec 2018 20:14:24
@LeafsGM. Thanks man. For your question, I think there’s a number of factors. European players are playing NCAA more now than ever in the past and that’s just natural progression. But I think a lot of the college programs now are run and coached by former NHL players and coaches too. It’s a lot more direct route to the NHL than it was years ago because the games aren’t so different as the used to be. Also NhL teams have a lot more scouts and resources dedicated to college games. Obviously having an education to fall back on is huge too because for every kid that becomes a millionaire hockey player, there's thousands more that are looking for a job in the real world.


17.) 13 Dec 2018 20:29:42
Jbs makes a good point too that if a us player moves to Canada to play in the CHL, he’s playong 15-20 year olds. IN NCAA, typically its 17-23 year olds. More Guys have their ‘man strength’ as they say. Some good Canadian players have gone NCAA route too like Toews and more recently Tyson Jost. He was a BCHL guy like MAkar where this conversation all started lol and went NCAA for a year before joining avs.


 

 

12 Dec 2018 03:07:35
Toronto trades Sandin
Colorado trades Makar

Sandin is looking outstanding. At this point I’d say the value looks pretty even. Avs need LHD just as much as we need RHD.

LeafsGM

1.) 12 Dec 2018 03:41:11
Aves laugh.


2.) 12 Dec 2018 04:22:33
Aves definatley say no, Sandin looks good right now, but Makar Has a much higher ceiling, not to mention is putting up really good numbers in the ncaa right now. As a leafs fan I’d love if they could land someone like Makar but it’s going to take much more than Sandin to pry him away,


 

 

03 Dec 2018 02:21:53
Looking at the Nylander signing, you got to think Dubas did an outstanding job here. He got his man. He got him at the cap hit he wanted. Nylander aberages $7.5 per year, so he gets his money. And that front loaded contract pretty well ensures he’s going to remain a Leaf for a while. I mean, this was a big deal, and Dubas handled it like a pro.

LeafsGM

1.) 03 Dec 2018 03:38:14
The reason it worked out like that is because Nylander held out, which you’ve been attacking him for on here since the beginning of the season. Dubas did a good job but part of that was probably ensuring the hold out you’ve been attacking Nylander for.


2.) 03 Dec 2018 04:53:33
The fact is, things could have gone sour. Nylander almost missed the entire season and Dubas may not have got a return for him. Both these guys could have ended up looking real bad. The holdout was complete b. s. Nylander should have signed for $6.9 beginning of the season and been on the team at the start of the year. To hold out a third of the year for the equivalent of $0.6M in salary ($7.5-$6.9) is selfish and greedy. Dubas turned a bad situation into a good one that satisfies everyone, and came out looking all the better for it.


3.) 03 Dec 2018 05:07:57
(7.5-6.9)*6 = $3.6M extra over the contract he made holding out. But, he loses 1/ 3 of his salary from this year for sitting out, which is 0.33* (10) = $3.3M.

So in all, Nylander gained ($3.6-$3.3)=$0.3M for missing out this whole time. Was it really worth it?


4.) 03 Dec 2018 07:48:55
Doesn't surprise me that leafsgm flip flops. He makes bold statements then when proven wrong, backtracked, deflects and makes excuses.

Shows his true character. At least I can admit what I am and when I am wrong lol.


5.) 03 Dec 2018 08:23:38
Your math is off on so many levels, I don't even know where to start.
And giving Nylander all the fault is pure hypocrisy, the Leafs are as much to fault as Nylander is. Each party fought hard for their goal, not more not less.


6.) 03 Dec 2018 11:04:40
Yes redwing, you only changed your username on more than one occasion because everyone on this site called you out. It was a year or two before you grew a set and admitted you are colt.


7.) 03 Dec 2018 14:00:50
What’s off with his math? $600k a year for 6years is $3.6 mill. This seasons salary is $10 mill and he gets $6.7mill of it. He has missed out on $3.3 mill. $3.6mill gain and $3.3 mill loss. Net gain $300k.


8.) 03 Dec 2018 14:14:56
And not all leaf fans blame Nylander. I don’t blame him for the awkward spot he was put in. I think he really overvalued himself, and that's fine. I’ve said it before on here, he’s guilty of what 90% of working people are guilty of. They think they’re worth more than their boss does. No blame, it’s settled.


9.) 03 Dec 2018 15:09:04
I didn’t backpedal, make excuses, or flip flop at all. I said it was a good contract, sure. But Nylander gained nothing from holding out this whole time. I even showed you the calculations that prove he gained nothing from a this. And my math is very correct as well. So $300k over six years for missing a third of the season is all Nylander gained fromtgis. Was it worth it? Probably not when Dubas would have signed him for that at the beginning of the year I’m sure.


10.) 03 Dec 2018 19:05:13
let's just say for fun he still only got an extra 300,000 that's still pretty good for 2 months of doing nothing it's a far cry from all this money you guys said he was missing out on by not playing. and if this was all it took why didn't dubas sign him two months ago?


11.) 03 Dec 2018 19:10:53
How much actual money does nylander get from this deal?


12.) 03 Dec 2018 20:02:01
He missed out on 27 games of his career for the money he would have made in 3-4 games. Those are games and missed stats that atvthe end of your career you can never get back. If he’s okay trading that for 300k while collecting $41+ mill, that’s up to him. I’ve said it lots, no Blame on him. He did what ember wanted and he gets to reap whatever benefits and suffer whatever consequences comes with it.


13.) 03 Dec 2018 20:27:56
How much actual money do he get from the entire contract?


14.) 03 Dec 2018 21:28:32
He gets $24.3 mill signing bonus over the entire term and $17.723 mill salary over the entire term.

$42,023,000 over 6 years. So pennies over $7 mill per.

It’s written up as $24.3mill bonus, $20.7mill salary for a total of $45mill (6x$7.5 mill)

However he gets 127 days worth of $10 mill this season which is 7,023,000. The rest evaporated with the hold out. Get it now?!


15.) 03 Dec 2018 21:34:56
After taking into account the loss of 1/ 3 his salary this year, he takes home about $42M over the course of six years. Or just shy of $7M. $6.9 is the figure thrown around. Which is probably right about where Dubas started his negotiations from what I’ve been reading this whole time. Dubas won these negotiations. And he did a damn good job at it too.


16.) 03 Dec 2018 23:10:04
So I've read that dubas first offer was 6 x6 so willy now gets an extra 1mil per year. I think it was worth his while to hold out. So say all you want that dubas won this but clearly nylander didn't lose. Get it now?


17.) 04 Dec 2018 00:55:45
Where did you read that? One of the reporters that in your own words you don’t believe and trust? Lol because I listened to Nylander talk for 15 min and dubas for 30 min and neither of them said that.

You said if the reporter doesn’t give his source it’s not true. So who was the source? Nylander, dubas, shanahan, Pridham, gross, Michael Nylander? Lol come one man. Stick to a set of rules for once 😂.


18.) 04 Dec 2018 01:02:48
You ask for all the numbers like you don’t believe them and repeatedly try to disprove them, when you finally realize they’re correct and it’s not bad, now unnamed sources amhave told you new information to sway it again?! Haha who’s article was it? Yupp? Lol.


19.) 04 Dec 2018 01:17:31
Pretty hard to “lose” when you are earning $7M a year. We can never know for sure where these guys started their negotiations. My understanding is Nylander started at $9.5, expecting to meet around $8, and Dubas started at $6, and refused to go past $7.

The only losers here were the fans, as always, who were left without their star 1RW to cheer on for a third of the season because he refused to play due to an honest, but mistaken, belief that he deserved more than his output to date would suggest he did.


20.) 04 Dec 2018 04:36:48
Leafsgm see I can't argue with that good job. Now if you go by reports nylander started at 8 or 8.5 and the leafs started at 6x6 or 2 years x 5mil. now like I said before I don't believe reports but I throw them out just to win an argument with jim. He thinks our arguments need things like rules and what not but he's just proving my point from the other day that those who are ready to put dubas on a pedestal for this deal only use the reports that make things in his favour. fact is we don't know what the initial offers were but I'd be willing to bet nylander got more then the initial offer from the leafs or he'd still be in Sweden. plus we can only assume what his actual market value is but I'd be suprised if anyone even leaf fans think he should be making more then pastranak. So I will say again it's not a bad deal for the leafs and I wouldn't call the leafs a total loser in this deal but if I was to pick a winner out of this negotiation I'd have to give the nod to nylander.


21.) 04 Dec 2018 04:40:18
I told you today pierre lebrun reported. I also remember at least one of dreger or mckenzie saying the exact same thing a month or so ago. But yeah I still don't believe they actually knew it to be true just like I don't believe nylander was looking for 8.5 mil. But if you guys want to use reports as an argument I guess I've got to throw the other ones your not talking about out there from time to time lol.


22.) 04 Dec 2018 04:42:32
An internet jockey like you jim shouldn't have much trouble finding those reports try looking somewhere other then the leafs websites that are also pumping dubas tires.


23.) 04 Dec 2018 12:59:25
I haven’t used those reports. I’ve said I personally feel he was $6.5-6.75 mill and could see an argument for calling anything under 7 a win long before he signed for $6.97 lol between the cap hit being under $7 mill and the structuring of bonuses and salaries that put leafs in total control of trading him and actually makes his contract more of an asset by the day makes it an easy win.

Believe what numbers you want, he obviously wanted more than this, they wanted to sign him for less clearly. But his fear was they were going to sign him for less and then trade him, and this contract makes that so easy to do going forward that I don’t see how he’s a big winner. He did alright. He got a bit more money and signed on the dotted line that gives so many more options to dubas from now on than he hadnt had before. Nylander gave up a ton to get that bit extra cash, which is fine, but he did concede important things.


24.) 04 Dec 2018 13:25:14
You think Nylander won. Fine.

I think team won. Fine

We will wait and see, the numbers (stats and contract) are very similar with inflation to Pastrnak. Did you think Pastrnak won that getting $6.67? I know a lot people that did. And a year later, not a chance he's getting whatbhes worth. Sweeney won that all day long. Now pasta was asked about it and says he has no regrets about signing it and is happy, same answer Morgan Rielly gave about his $5 mill deal, but if you think those aren’t team friendly deals and wins for the organizations, you’re absolutely wrong.

So we will wait and see what Nylander does, but with him only 22 years old, similar path to this point of pasta and the structure of the contract I’m very confident saying this will be better for the team than him. Either because he outperforms the contract or he’s moved to a team he didint want to sign with and leafs get a great return.


25.) 04 Dec 2018 15:12:13
Ok we'll let's just say nobody won then. Neither got exactly what they wanted so they both lose lol.


26.) 04 Dec 2018 15:23:17
I never once said the leafs wouldn't become the winner in a few years. I said nylander won this negotiation. Nobody knows how good or bad that deal will look in 5 years. leafs won the tavares sweepstakes but is that deal going to seem like a winner in year 7? Maybe, but who knows. Reilly's deal at the time was fair for him maybe slightly high if anything it's good now but I don't think a lot of people were saying it was a huge win for the leafs when they signed him. i seem to remember a few saying they liked the deal and it was good for both sides which is what they should be saying about the nylander deal.


 

 

 

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05 Feb 2019 17:52:00
@thunderturkey

Washington can’t afford that. But Burakovsky is still available, and his salary would be almost enough to cover Zaitsev’s. That might hold more appeal for Washington. Although I question how much need Cap’s really have for Zaitsev.

LeafsGM

 

 

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05 Feb 2019 17:43:20
The Edmonton trade doesn’t appear to be nearly as lopsided as the rest. It’s actually pretty reasonable. A 1st+ either Pulj or Bear for Stone seems right on. The rest of the guys are just white noise and shouldn’t be cause for making or breaking the deal. I suppose more than anything, this deal centres around how you view Puljujarvi. In my opinion, which means nothing lol, I think it’s time Edmonton looks at moving on from Puljujarvi while they can still get a decent return. By this time next year if he hasn’t broken out in any way, even his biggest supporters would have to be calling him a bust at that point, and his value will be a fraction of what you might still be able to get for him now.

LeafsGM

 

 

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05 Feb 2019 17:34:57
Zaitsev’s contract isn’t that unbearable. Compared to Seabrook, Keith, Shattenkirk, Staal, just for example, Zaitsev has a dream contract. It’s virtually unanimous among analysts that I’ve read saying he’s overpaid, but not grossly so. It’s still a very tradeable contract to a team looking to add low cost defense help without breaking the bank.

LeafsGM

 

 

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05 Feb 2019 17:03:40
I’m not seeing it here Pinball. Dermott and Brown are young, cost controlled, long term blue chip roster players. While I’m not against moving Brown, who is underutilized and overpaid for 4th line duties, I’m not sure if trading both Dermott and Brown for a couple rentals is the way to go either.

For the “win-now” guys, this trade holds appeal because it does slightly make us better for this year and next. For those with a long-term outlook, this trade probably doesn’t look as appealing.

LeafsGM

 

 

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30 Jan 2019 19:03:08
Considering his style of play, I’m very impressed without gidas’ possession metrics. He’s a damn good player. Would love him on the Leafs.

LeafsGM

 

 

 

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